1968 expired Aerographic Panatomic-X 70mm

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by grobbit, Feb 6, 2013.

  1. grobbit

    grobbit Member

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    Hi folks

    I recently picked up some dirt cheap Panatomic-X, it's the Aero version in 15ft lengths, 70mm perf, so ideal for my Mamiya 70mm backs I use with my Century and Speed Graphic 23s.

    It expired in 1968, but I suspect it will still be fine.

    I mostly use Microdol-X 1:3 and I read it was ideal for Pan-X.

    Before I shoot some of this stuff, I would like some tips. What speed should I rate it at, given the age? I usually rate at half box speed if developing in 1:3 M-X as I love the tonality I get.

    Is the Aero version any difference to regular Pan-X?
     
  2. vpwphoto

    vpwphoto Member

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    It is all in your court. Expose some make records of exposures... I'd photograph a grey card with a baseball, and some other items lit by the sun say on the steps of your house at noon. Make records, perhaps run a couple batches. Microdol-X, I always understood reduced the sharp edges of grain in high speed film. I'd go with D-76 or HC-110.

    No point in any of "us" offering specifics as to your claim "I suspect it will be fine". I may have been heated to 110+F for a day or a week or most of several summers in a warehouse, or the trunk of a 1964 Chevy.. Most people would have thrown that film out in 1977 let alone 1997 or 2007.

    Let us know what you find, you have work to do if you are going to use this film, go to it.
     
  3. John Shriver

    John Shriver Member

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    I bought a bulk roll of Aero Plus-X. When I developed it to a reasonable contrast index, it was quite slow, like EI 50 was about right. It was also surprisingly grainy!

    The Aero films are designed to developed for contrast index of 0.75 to 0.85, to make up for atmospheric haze. When you pull back to CI 0.6 you lose a good bit of speed. So in your bracketing tests, bracket towards the lower EI side.
     
  4. StoneNYC

    StoneNYC Subscriber

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    I'm guessing you bought this on eBay lol.

    There's a LOT of 70mm out there, I wasn't too pleased with the Tri-x nor the Pan-X I got from the 60's but the GAF seems amazing lol. I haven't tried the.

    The Tri-X was SUPER foggy, so good luck, I suggest fixing it for a few extra minutes than normal. It will curl a lot so scanning or printing will be more difficult. Have you found a 70mm spool? They aren't easy to come by.

    I've learned a lot from all the 70mm I've shot, I love the stuff it's a pain but somehow satisfying.

    I would suggest developers that are really fast like I used ilfsol 3 because of the 4 minute dev times it cuts down on fog it seems any really short dev time developer is recommended for older films.

    That's my 2 cents




    ~Stone

    Mamiya: 7 II, RZ67 Pro II / Canon: 1V, AE-1, 5DmkII / Kodak: No 1 Pocket Autographic, No 1A Pocket Autographic | Sent w/ iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  5. StoneNYC

    StoneNYC Subscriber

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    Oh and there's a "general rule" to cut off one stop per 10 years, so if a film expired in 1993 with an ASA of 400 I would shoot that at 100 because as it ages it loses speed. Unless its been frozen then it's a different story so knowing the history is important. The oldest I've gone is 1947 film that I act silly over exposed because it seems the "slow down factor" levels off after a few decades... So if its 35 years I suggest cutting it to 25 years of compensation (and make sure to account for the change in the design of film speed ratings, they DOUBLED the speed factor at some point in the past.

    I went and dug up the last roll of Panatomic-X I shot from the 60s,

    [​IMG]

    As you can see I labeled it as shooting at EI 12....

    And here is a strip on my light box to show density...

    [​IMG]

    That should be helpful...


    ~Stone

    Mamiya: 7 II, RZ67 Pro II / Canon: 1V, AE-1, 5DmkII / Kodak: No 1 Pocket Autographic, No 1A Pocket Autographic | Sent w/ iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  6. grobbit

    grobbit Member

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    Thanks for the info guys, looks like 12 is a good starting point. For developing, I have an old Nebro tank with adjustable spiral and one of the settings is for 116 which is the same width as 70mm.

    For developers, I have Fomadon LQN, Fomadon LQR, Ornano ST20, Microdol-X, Celer-Stellar and RO9, I'll start with the Microdol-X and go from there.

    Yup, I got this on ebay. I've seen the GAF stuff, tempted to grab some, but shipping to England makes it not so cheap.

    I missed out on 150ft of Agfa Ortho 25 last week, German seller and he wouldn't accept paypal, and doing an international bank transfer can get expensive.

    I'm on the hunt for more 70mm, I mostly shoot BW, but I have several 100ft rolls of Fujichrome duplicating film in the fridge so I have lots of E6 in 70mm.
     
  7. StoneNYC

    StoneNYC Subscriber

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    Good luck, it doesn't show much on the light box but I wasn't happy with the base fog in these negs either, but it wasn't terrible..

    Also, this particular batch of film I developed in DD-X and not Ilfsol 3 because it was a mixed batch of old films and I was more playing around than being specific, but I THINK my Dev time was 5 minutes... It would have been 4 in Ilfsol 3... Hope that also helps.


    ~Stone

    Mamiya: 7 II, RZ67 Pro II / Canon: 1V, AE-1, 5DmkII / Kodak: No 1 Pocket Autographic, No 1A Pocket Autographic | Sent w/ iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  8. MartinCrabtree

    MartinCrabtree Member

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    Please post an example of the outcome. I'm curious.
     
  9. grobbit

    grobbit Member

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    Sure Martin, I'll be posting the results.
     
  10. MartinCrabtree

    MartinCrabtree Member

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    Thanks.
     
  11. ambaker

    ambaker Subscriber

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    Ok, I don't have anything that shoots 70mm film. I don't have any aero graphic film. But now I'm hooked on the suspense. Looking forward to the results, as well.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
     
  12. grobbit

    grobbit Member

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    Cool, I have the 70mm back on the Century Graphic and loaded up ready to shoot, but now I've discovered the slower speeds on the shutter that's mounted on it stick open so only the top four speeds work. Oh well, I can probably get a decent test run of the 3 feet of film I put in it just using those speeds, then I'll have to give the shutter a clean. Luckily I have a 6.8/65 Angulon to fit it as well so I can swap the lenses after this test roll.

    This is my Century Graphic before I put the 70mm back on it, lens is a Linhof Schneider Xenar 3.5/105.
     

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  13. StoneNYC

    StoneNYC Subscriber

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    Any news?

    I purchased a can of 70mm Panatomic-X from a guy on eBay who has a bunch, I bought it before you posted this but hadn't gotten around to shooting it.

    I just opened the can and it DEFINTELY has vinegared, strong vinegar smell.

    If yours is similar I certainly WOULD NOT put this in your camera, the shots might come out but as I've learned the resulting film could affect other film you store with it, destroying it with vapors of vinegar type acid, and the same is true with the camera back, the acid can damage the camera, be careful.


    ~Stone

    Mamiya: 7 II, RZ67 Pro II / Canon: 1V, AE-1, 5DmkII / Kodak: No 1 Pocket Autographic, No 1A Pocket Autographic | Sent w/ iPhone using Tapatalk