4"x 5" Enlarger - Durst Laborator

Discussion in 'Enlarging' started by MarcoGiardini, Sep 10, 2010.

  1. MarcoGiardini

    MarcoGiardini Subscriber

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    I'm finally arrived to a large format camera (sinar P2) and i now need an elnlarger for this format (4x5")
    I have a durst 805 used to print from the 35mm to 6x9 but i need something larger now.
    I do not have space for 2 enlargers, so i want to print from the 35mm to the 4x5 on the same enlarger. I was thinking about the Durst Laborator 1200 but is not clear to me if the CLS 500 or CLS 501 are capable to print the large format. Do they need a special film tray and some special stuff to print the LF? and if yes, what do they need?
    thanks a lot

    marco
     
  2. Adrian Twiss

    Adrian Twiss Member

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    The laborator will handing up to 4xinch with the standard negaive carrier. Just make sure that it has both top and bottom negative glasses. You will also need the appropriate 4x5 mixing box. Although much rarer for monochrome you cannot beat the VLS501 head although the colour heads will work, if you know the filtration for the paper you are using.

    For smaller formats you will need the appropriate negagive masks. They come in pairs but I use a negaive mask on the bottom and glass on the top. Theoretically you will also need the appropriate mixing box as well. You can get away with a 4x5 mixing box for 4x5 down to 6x9cm and a 6x6 mixing box for 6x6 and 35mm.

    I hope this helps

    Adrian
     
  3. MarcoGiardini

    MarcoGiardini Subscriber

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    Thanks Adrian. so you confim me that the standard holder supports up to the 5x4 and i need the 4x5 mixing box. Do you know the name of the 4x5 mixing box? is it the same fot the L900 or is specific for the 1200?
    thanks
     
  4. 36cm2

    36cm2 Member

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    Adrian said it perfectly. I had purchased separate enlargers to work from 35mm up to 4x5, but now use only the L1200. It's just great. If you can find one in good condition with the accessories you need at your price point, don't hesitate.
     
  5. 36cm2

    36cm2 Member

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    I think the mixing box is the Femobox45. Send me a PM and I'll see if I can find my manual. It has a list of all the accessories that is helpful.

    Leo
     
  6. MarcoGiardini

    MarcoGiardini Subscriber

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    i have found a Durst L900 with CLS 500 and all the mix box up to the 6x9. But i need to print also the 4x5. so if i can find the femobox 45 i should be able to print from 35mm to 4x5.
    Ebay....please.......help me!
    :smile:
    thanks
     
  7. frobozz

    frobozz Subscriber

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    Hate to say, you just missed one on ebay from San Francisco that went for $8.50.... but there will be more!

    Duncan
     
  8. Adrian Twiss

    Adrian Twiss Member

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    I thought the L900, as the baby brother of the L1200, would only print up to 6x9 inches. The only other Durst that will do 5x4 (IIRC) is the 138 which goes up to 5x7 but is an enormous beast. I would check this out before committing to buy.

    In fact, see the following thread

    http://www.apug.org/forums/forum43/33375-need-some-info-durst-l900-cls-450-head.html
     
  9. MarcoGiardini

    MarcoGiardini Subscriber

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    Thanks adrian, thanks a lot. But a 1200 here in europe is quite hard to find and is not that cheap!i will go on searching!
    thanks


     
  10. Marco B

    Marco B Member

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    Marco,

    The L1200 will print up to 4x5 inch, Adrian is wrong that only the 138 can do it. Here's an image printed on my L1200:

    [​IMG]

    I did not mask out the actual image edges (which you can with the negative mask), hence the apparently clipped corners (which are caused by the negative mask's design), but those "clips" are actually outside the regular printing area of a 4x5 negative, if the negative is properly placed, you only lose a tiny fraction.

    Also, my Ilford Multigrade 500H light head for the L1200 comes with 4x5 mixing boxes...

    L1200's are actually quite common here in Europe I think, certainly more than the 138. I know they were used quite a lot here in the Netherlands, and you still see them pop up once in a while on sites like e-bay.
     
  11. Adrian Twiss

    Adrian Twiss Member

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    My reply was not entirely clear. I meant that in addition to the L1200 the only other enlarger that would do 5x4 is the 138. I also failed to mention Durst's 10x8 range assuming that they were outside the scope of this thread. My point was that as the original poster mentioned the L900 that it will not print a 5x4 enlarger.
     
  12. Fourtoes

    Fourtoes Member

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    The Lab 1000 and the Lab 54 (which I now have set up) both enlarge up to 5x4 with appropriate holders and masks and condensers.
     
  13. MarcoGiardini

    MarcoGiardini Subscriber

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    Marco, what's the price in holland fir the L1200 complete of mixingbox for the 35mm, 6x9 and 10x12?
    Thanks
     
  14. RalphLambrecht

    RalphLambrecht Subscriber

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  15. MarcoGiardini

    MarcoGiardini Subscriber

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    @MarcoB: wooow, great picture!
     
  16. johnnywalker

    johnnywalker Subscriber

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    Fourtoes is right, don't forget the L1000, which also does from 4X5 down.
     
  17. RobertV

    RobertV Member

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    I had a L1200 incl. all Femoboxes and Rodenstock enlarger lenses 50-80-150mm from a local lab for Eur. 350,00

    In mint condition but impossible to ship these monsters.
    They can just fit into a regular car in Holland :smile:

    But you have to be lucky. In my negative format I go till 6x7 (cm) so I sold the unit.
     
  18. Marco B

    Marco B Member

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    Ralph: I have also all the appropriate mixing boxes and lenses for 35mm, MF and 4x5 LF for my Ilford Multigrade 500H head, so can potentially print everything with that.

    However, since I only work with 35mm and 4x5 at the moment (still need to get a MF set), and have a second enlarger in the form of a Durst 670 BW, that does 35mm very nicely, I simply stick with doing 4x5 on the L1200. Although it is not difficult, having to swap out lenses and mixing boxes is still a bit more work than firing up the 670 BW...

    I bought mine, including some 6 good enlarger lenses (I had doubles, please note you will need three different enlarger lenses to cover all formats: a 50mm lens for 35mm film format, a 105mm lens for MF and a 150mm for 4x5), Ilford Multigrade 500H system complete including 2 analyzers (not necessary, I don't use them) and two paper masks for 700,- euro...

    But that was some 5 years ago... still not bad, considering such a set probably cost the equivalent of some 7000,- euro new back when they were still produced.

    Like Robert said, these are hefty machines. I guess it might be something like 30-35 kilo, and that is excluding the Ilford 600 Watt power supply that in my case alone already weighs an incredible 10,3(!) kilo's :blink:

    I also do have the feeling that the number of available second hand enlargers has significantly dropped, especially the good ones like Dursts. Probably mainly because most of them did not sell and/or ended up on the landfill, but maybe also because of some renewed interest by younger people buying the last remaining stuff.

    Anyway, I do see an interesting recent advertisement on a Dutch site:

    http://www.fotoapparatuur.nl/Durst/Vergroter/Durst-Laborator-138-S/Ad122576.html

    It is for the even bigger Durst Laborator 138S, for 500,- euro.

    That is not so special, but this one has a story accompanying it according to the descriptive text :laugh:. I don't know if you know her, but it used to be owned by Rineke Dijkstra, a female Dutch photographic artist who has had some major international success with her 4x5 LF portrait series of children-on-beaches and some other stuff. See for example this short bio on the site of the Tate Modern:

    http://www.tate.org.uk/modern/exhibitions/cruelandtender/dijkstra.htm

    or this one from the Marian Goodman gallery including some well known images:

    http://www.mariangoodman.com/artists/rineke-dijkstra/

    It is sold by Annaleen Louwes, another Dutch photographic artist, less famous, but I see her listed with one of the most prominent Dutch photo galleries...

    So if you want an enlarger with a story :wink::D

    There is also a recent listing for a seemingly very nice (and I think autofocus) Durst Pictochrom Plus AF. I hadn't seen these before, but Googling tells me it is essentially a motorized L1200, designed for use in commercial labs!

    http://www.fotoapparatuur.nl/Durst/Doka/kleurvergroter/Ad125590.html

    I am a bit puzzled though by the 6x7 inch max in the advertisement text, according to this Durst document, it should print up to 4x5 inch... I guess the seller confuses 6x7 cm MF negatives with being LF and wrote that down...

    The price for this motorized beast is not listed, it says it is negotiable...

    I hauled mine in a Volkswagen Golf after unscrewing the base board and removing the Ilford Multigrade head... but the 138S is a real beast needing a truck or mini-van at least...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 12, 2010
  19. RobertV

    RobertV Member

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  20. Adrian Twiss

    Adrian Twiss Member

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    You know I had forgotten all about the Lab 1000 and Lab 54.

    Another alternative, if a laborator is to difficult to obtain is the Devere 504. These enlargers enjoy an excellent reputation for quality and may be easier to find. Prices should be fairly comparable to the Durst.
     
  21. MarcoGiardini

    MarcoGiardini Subscriber

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    Thanks everybody, i have already started searching for a Lab1200 complete of all mixboxes for the different formats in europe.
    If any of you should know about someone who is going to sell his Lab1200, please inform me.
    thanks

    marco
     
  22. Marco B

    Marco B Member

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    I think De Vere enlargers are far more common in your home country where they are produced as well, than in some of the other European countries. I have rarely seen De Vere enlargers advertised second hand here in the Netherlands.

    They look well build and solid like Dursts though, and one thing I like about the 504 from the images I see, is the focussing knobs below the base board. Although I love my Durst L1200, one thing that bothers me about it, is the need to awkwardly grapple "above" your head for the focussing controls while looking through the grain focuser... I think I have read somewhere there is supposed to be a "newer" version of the L1200 that had some metal stick dangling down allowing you to more comfortably focus, but that is still not the same as with the De Vere 504, and they seem less common on the 2nd hand market.
     
  23. Adrian Twiss

    Adrian Twiss Member

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    You are quite right. My L1200 has a telescopic arm for both focussing and changing the filtration on the head.