A matter of millimeters

Discussion in 'Color: Film, Paper, and Chemistry' started by aoluain, Sep 5, 2011.

  1. aoluain

    aoluain Member

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    Hi All,

    I tried to load some 120 colour film onto both a Paterson and AP plastic
    reel last night which took about 40 minutes.

    After I had finished developing I realised the film had just wound
    together just inside the outer circumference of the reel instead of
    winding in towards the centre so I lost about half of the frames
    obviously as they were touching together.

    I realised after the neg had dried that the width of the film was
    59.5mm but the normal width should be 61mm.
    they just will not wind into the reel :sad:

    I have another 4 rolls of this batch to develop - any ideas ?
     
  2. Rick A

    Rick A Subscriber

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    You can try stainless steel reels and tanks. I just measured my ss and plastic reels, plastic is definitly a no-go and the ss should go.
     
  3. markbarendt

    markbarendt Subscriber

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    Although I curse a bit when loading my plastic reels for color film I have yet to see a film that wouldn't fit, regardless of brand.

    Biggest problems for me have been with the leading corners catching so I bend the film back a bit to "flatten" it a bit and clip the leading corners at an angle. Smaller clips work better for me.
     
  4. Jeff Kubach

    Jeff Kubach Member

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    I never had a problem loading my 120 film on to the Patterson tank. Did you load it in the right direction?

    Jeff
     
  5. aoluain

    aoluain Member

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    thanks guys, i never have problems loading 120 either but as this 120
    is narrower than the standard 61mm, it just will not stay in the spiral channels.

    im thinking of modifying a plastic reel to accomodate this.

    Rick - you recon the SS reel would hold a neg 59.5mm ?
     
  6. kerne

    kerne Member

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    Out of curiosity, what type of film is it? I can measure my Hewes reel when I get home, but I've never had a prob with it.
     
  7. aoluain

    aoluain Member

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    Hi Kerne - its Kodak Aerochrome, loaded from bulk.
     
  8. eddie

    eddie Member

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    Are you getting it from one of the sources that cuts it to 120?
     
  9. aoluain

    aoluain Member

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    Hi Eddie,

    Yes the roll was cut from bulk.
     
  10. eddie

    eddie Member

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    It sounds like it was cut just a bit too narrow.
     
  11. aoluain

    aoluain Member

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    exactly eddie!

    i think i can modify a plastic reel easily enough.

    anybody had any experience of narrow films?
     
  12. bblhed

    bblhed Member

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    Unless you have a lifetime supply of this film and plan to shoot only this film, go out and buy an ss setup, tank and reel. if you modify your reel it will end up in the trash, a ss tank and reel can be passed on or held as a spare, or even worse, you might like it and switch. :smile:

    Also if you get an ss setup, there is no way you will ever grab the wrong reel by accident.
     
  13. aoluain

    aoluain Member

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    thanks bblhed - yea i did consider that but i would need to know
    if the ss gear would hold the narrower film?
    i was planning on ripping a paterson reel apart as I find it a hatefull
    piece of plastic at the best of times.
    but yes i see where the ss one might be a better option.
     
  14. eddie

    eddie Member

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    See if the film you've already processed will fit in the SS reel first.
     
  15. aoluain

    aoluain Member

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    thanks eddie, I dont have any ss reels! Im going to try and source a
    120 reel and tank, from what I have found out the "opening" of the reels is 57mm so that souuld work.

    thanks for the help.
     
  16. Monito

    Monito Member

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    The thing about stainless steel reels is that you can feel the film as it warps onto the reel and you'll know if it is jumping a row onto the film below it. Just make sure your hands are grease free before loading: wiping onto dry cloth or clothing is sufficient if the hands are already clean.
     
  17. aoluain

    aoluain Member

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    cool thanks monito - yea it should be easier to load from the centre out !
     
  18. EdSawyer

    EdSawyer Member

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    Is this some of the Infrared Aerochrome the seller (Dean?) is cutting down and respooling onto 120 reels and selling on ebay? I had thought of getting some of that but if he's not cutting it down to standard size, that would be a deal-killer...
     
  19. Athiril

    Athiril Subscriber

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    Plastic isn't a "no-go", plastic is preferable imho for higher temperature work, as the tank is insulated.

    57mm is less to work with than the 55mm of a patterson reel. It sounds like you need to work on loading technique and clean your reels and make sure they are actually dry.. a drop of water will make the gelatin very adhesive against the reel.. as opposed to a completely saturated amount of water which will actually load onto the reel.

    The depth into the track is about 2mm from what I can tell, so you should be able to load a film greater than 57mm width, edited: below to 3.5mm

    a 61mm width film looks like it has 1mm of wiggle room to move, so that would put a depth of 3.5mm (I assume) into the track a film can sit. At 59.5, your film should be able to sit inside both tracks (fully sitting on one depth of 3.5mm, it has still 1mm into the other side), but could easily 'pop out' on one side than a regular film, if you load it carefully you should be fine, if you are paying attention to loading you should be able to feel what the film is doing.

    At 57mm, there is 1.5mm into the tracks.. thats counting an exact fit for 61mm width without any kind of movement to allow for slight differences of films.. which obviously there should be... you're left with less than 1mm of depth into the track from a 59.5mm room on a 57mm opening reel.. in fact, if there is 1mm of wiggle room, your film will not fit on the reel, as when it fully inserts on one side, the other side will be free/out of the track.

    Though it would be good to test load a 120 steel reel with the old film, since it has a center clip which might help.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 17, 2011