Agfa Cinerex - tests and recommendation

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Mark Crabtree, Apr 30, 2012.

  1. Mark Crabtree

    Mark Crabtree Member

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    I'm starting a thread here for test results with the 35mm Agfa Cinerex IC1N 50asa orthochromatic film that was sold by APUG'er "Field".

    I ran a quick initial test with the film. Here are some initial thoughts.

    The film is packed loose in black plastic (no can or other wrapper) open it in the dark:smile: I spooled about half onto an old Fuji bulk reel from 100' film; the film base on this is thin, so half easily gets it into my Lloyds loader.

    I did a bracket test roll of plus and minus a stop from EI 25, then did a clip test in my replenished Xtol at my normal Tri-X time. My actual time isn't useful for others since this is a replenished tank.

    EI 25 looks very good. EI 50 has decent shadow detail too and may be close to what would be considered a normal ISO number. It certainly looks like that is a good working range.

    My normal Tri-X developing time isn't too far off. It is certainly not too short, and is probably a little long. It is hard to judge until I make some prints. I'll probably shoot at EI 25 and back off a bit on the time until I have a better feel for the film.

    Grain is fine, but not as fine as Acros or TMX. The grain is very crisp and sharpness looks excellent, with a high acutance look.

    I'll be looking forward to hearing more opinions and suggestions here.
     
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  2. Field

    Field Member

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    I'm curious about getting the development time down. It might "grain-out" real fast, and otherwise be much less grainy; closer to Acros or TMX maybe.

    I haven't tried it in Rodinal yet, but it could be good if I can get development times to a minimium with it.
     
  3. Rolfe Tessem

    Rolfe Tessem Subscriber

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    EI50 in Xtol 1:1 @ 20˚C @ 10.5 min. is close, but doesn't have much shadow detail. I'm going to try EI25 and cut the developing time a bit.
     
  4. zsas

    zsas Member

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    Interesting Rolfe, just shot my roll at 50, and planed on Xtol 1:1 for 10.5, you think I should I up the dev to say 13.5? It is cloudy here when I shot it.
     
  5. Richard S. (rich815)

    Richard S. (rich815) Subscriber

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    I'll be trying it oh Rodinal, HC-110 and D-76 bit not likely until the next couple of weeks.
     
  6. Field

    Field Member

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    A friend that has some film has been trying to shoot in-between EI25 and EI50, and been enjoying results. I'm mixed becasue some of my EI50 shots are so pretty to me.

    This one lacks some in the shadows, but the skin tone is very good given the lighting. The shirt is extra dark because it is a red shirt.

    6983233026_eb3e9b7803_b.jpg
     
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  7. Rolfe Tessem

    Rolfe Tessem Subscriber

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    Andy, no I wouldn't up the development or you'll get too much contrast. The issue, if there is one and it isn't just the spectral response, is the shadow detail. Midrange and highlights are fully developed at 10.5 min.
     
  8. Richard S. (rich815)

    Richard S. (rich815) Subscriber

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    I'll be trying it with Rodinal, HC-110 and D-76 but not likely until the next couple of weeks.
     
  9. zsas

    zsas Member

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    Thanks Rolfe, will go for 10.5 1:1 tonight, ty
     
  10. zsas

    zsas Member

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    What interesting film. Washed clear. Just black and white. Odd, neat, cool. Like a chrome.

    Took a pic of my daughter, the fence wood is quite interesting.

    At 50, Xtol 1:1, 10:30 seconds. Neg scan for now.

    Really interesting stuff. Nice to have in my bag! Thanks Field, this is everything I hoped for, a film that is odd, different and fun to play around with!

    [​IMG]
     
  11. John Austin

    John Austin Member

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    Come on Australia Post - Now this thread is started I too am looking forward to this film - I have no problem if it ends up being contrasty in my replenished D76d, made up in 1985 and improving with age - The extra contrast will be welcome as the dedicated camera for this film is a Retina, which is good and sharp enough, but has soft tonality

    jbaphoto111018d932.jpg

    The camera was bought by my wife from a charity shop in England for peanuts, she bought it as she thought it was pretty
     
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  12. Mark Crabtree

    Mark Crabtree Member

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    Your wife was right; that is a pretty camera. D76 should be dandy with this film. Our film in the states came from Field by Priority Mail, which is a 2 day service (sort of).

    My impression is that the contast of the Agfa is very controllable; I'm going to experiment more with clip tests from my bracketed roll shortly, then develop a test roll I just shot on my bicycle ride.

    Andy, you sure beat us all (except Field, of course) with a very nice picture.
     
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  13. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    if anyone wants to process this lovely film in coffee ... send me a PM
    it might work well with your high contrast film :smile:
     
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  15. Field

    Field Member

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    Andy that Xtol really works well with this film... I wonder why mine come out a tiny bit brown, the negetaives... hm whatever they scan fine.
     
  16. zsas

    zsas Member

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    Brown negs in Xtol? Odd. If it doesn't affect your flow, makes no difference. Tomorrow looks to be sunny, got a roll of 10 or so frames bulked, gonna try ISO 25 and cut the dev a bit maybe 7:45, think mine was cooked a bit, but my daughter's hair is quite light, she has blue eyes too which the ortho film had its way with (ie making them real light looking). Love that look, was expecting her skin to be more stark and harsh but it looks great, her complexion is very pink/red. This film is fun, never tried ortho. It sure looks great when photographing wood, need to find an old red barn now....

    Grumpy - USPS to AU...wow that might take a bit, maybe by a week from now? Well, that will give you time to get that beaut camera nice n clean.

    Mark I look forward to your results! I do need some advisement, suggestions from you all.

    I just shot it quickly at lunch today with a Olympus XA quickly to see if I can get a good neg. I didn't have time to take notes, had to get back to work....can't wait till the weekend....

    More scans folks!
     
  17. Field

    Field Member

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    EI25 at 5.5 minutes in Tmax 1:4 was underdeveloped by about a stop. A few photos accidently taken at like EI10, came out pretty close. I'm going to try 6.5 minutes for EI25 next. I'd post photos but it'd be a waste.
     
  18. Mark Crabtree

    Mark Crabtree Member

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    Andy, all I got was more test and comparison shots with what light was left when I took my bicycle ride this evening. I'm very envious of you actually getting a nice shot on your first go.

    My experience is similar to you and Field. I backed off about 20 percent from my normal Tri-X time in replenished Xtol and that is getting close, but still a little long for contrasty light I was shooting. Printed fine with with lower contrast filter in the enlarger.

    I'm also seeing shadow detail more linked to developement time than I'm used to. Certainly EI 25 is about the max with my reduced development; a little more exposure would have been nice on some. Not much latitude compared to the films I'm used to, buy probably about normal for this speed film.

    I ran the last short piece of my bracket test roll in Acufine since I'd just freshened up my replenished bottle of it. It looked promising, but the time would have to be very short. It sure pulled the shadows up, but everything else too.

    Grumpy Old Man, this may really be just the thing to perk up your Retina.
     
  19. Field

    Field Member

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    Actually compared to Efke/Adox this stuff is much more versitile. Even at EI100 I think it could be used, just not ideal. We have to accept that it is going to be pretty contrasty stuff by nature.

    My avatar is at EI100. Printing on an enlarger (I use color enlarger) it would come out fine with a higher contrast filtration, I believe.
     
  20. John Austin

    John Austin Member

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    First thing I did with the Retina after its first roll (APX100) was to send it to the only repair man I trust in Australia to check, clean and fix the slow speeds, which were all about 1/25th

    This sort of work I never do myself as I have seen too many stuff ups by people who say "cleaning a shutter is easy" - Paying an expert is much cheaper than a new shutter

    Anyway, everything is ready for the Agfa film's arrival

    John
     
  21. zsas

    zsas Member

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    Can't wait Grumpy to see your results!

    Bulked another roll of 10 frames, it's drying now (see below), might be able to scan a few tonight. Won't be printing till probably the weekend though.

    [​IMG]
     
  22. eurekaiv

    eurekaiv Member

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    It's going to be ages before I get around to trying out mine but it's on my list of projects. In the meantime, I'll be following this thread closely to see how it's going. Looking forward to seeing everyone's results! :munch:
     
  23. zsas

    zsas Member

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    My 2nd roll's negs as you saw two threads up are way too thin....hummm

    Shot at 25 dev Xtol 1:1 for 8 mins. Think I went the wrong way

    Should have gone 25 ISO and maybe 13.5 or so ???

    The initial roll at 50 for 1:1 Xtol for 13.5 mins were pretty thin too but the blown highlights made me think shoot slower but cut the dev. Anyone getting thicker negs?
     
  24. Field

    Field Member

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    If you shoot slower you need less development, but as I found out not as less as you think.

    EI50 at 7 minutes, and tonight I'm going to do EI25 at 6.5 because 5.5 wasn't even close to enough.
     
  25. Field

    Field Member

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    Don't forget dilluting developer can widen the spectrum of time if you find that you are inbetween half minute intervals.
     
  26. Mark Crabtree

    Mark Crabtree Member

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    I was hoping they weren't as thin as they look in the picture. You don't mention the temperature. 13.5 to 8' is an awfully big cut (20 percent makes a pretty noticeable difference), but it sure seems like that 8 minutes should be plenty long. Could something else have gone wrong?

    My negs are coming out very nice in replenished Xtol. I'm down to about a Plus-X sort of time (maybe a bit less). EI 25 seems good, but none to much; I'm tending to like even a bit more now. I've been shooting very contrasty scenes since that is what I've had on my bicycle rides.

    This seems like a pretty normal orthochromatic film; nothing really weird. I did a straight comparison with a nearby scene I'd shot a couple weeks ago on panchromatic film and the difference is not dramatic. I'm enjoying a chance to get a feel for the ortho look since I've been researching some old photos that I suspect were ortho.

    Filters seem to work out fine using the factors for old ortho Verichrome film. A #12 gets 2.5X and the look is very nice. A #15 needs a 5X factor, which is getting impractical for handheld use.

    Also worth noting is that the film doesn't seem to have much of an antihalation layer. There is a bit of dyed color to the unprocessed film which may be for that purpose. Strong specular highlights tend to flare out just a bit, but really nothing outrageous. I'm not sure if light piping is an issue, but I've been careful to load in subdued light and am carrying my rolls in black film containers.
     
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