Another "how to create this look"-Thread :)

Discussion in 'Color: Film, Paper, and Chemistry' started by Grinschus, May 15, 2013.

  1. Grinschus

    Grinschus Member

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    Hello everybody,

    first of all i apoligize for my bad english and lack of "photographic words". I try to explain in a very subjectiv way and hope you can understand everything.

    Actually i try to develope my one photography style and want to try out two "looks":

    1.
    http://www.ostkreuz.de/feature/434?fp=3&photographer=3&fi=20
    http://www.ostkreuz.de/feature/97?fp=4&photographer=3&fi=30
    (espen Eichhöfer)

    To me this style seems to have a yellow cast while the colour balance ist stil very good. In my opinion the colours also seem to be very saturated (for a colour negativ film). I almost seems to look like colour slide, but provia 400 x or colour slide with lower iso has a to "clear" look and is to sharp for this kind of style...and for a documentary work in medium format i belive both photographer would not work with 100-200 iso films...
    My first idea was to overexposure colour negative (1 1/2 - 2 stops), develope normal and then print and soft paper.
    Actually every film i tried ( Portra 400, fuji pro 400h and seems to be to soft) After scanning i try to increase the contrast, which does really look unnatural.
    At the moment i have only possibility to scan on a imacon, but i more and more belive that this and the photographer below develope and print their work in a lab.


    2.
    http://www.ostkreuz.de/feature/121?fp=2&photographer=8&fi=9
    http://www.ostkreuz.de/feature/288?photographer=8&fi=4
    (Ute Mahler)

    I dont have really an idea how to get this style. There is a lot of deep black, while the middle-tones seem to be some kind of soft. Colour balance is not flat and this goes more in a ducumentary style with no "over-beauty skintones" :smile:




    I hope someone could help me.

    Best regards,

    Luke
     
  2. timparkin

    timparkin Member

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    It's very difficult to guess but the best I could come up with is E100G (from the blues and greens) for the first and Astia (slight tendency to yellow) for the second. Colour neg is so dependent on the scanning that it's difficult to guess and I would expect you could get close to that feel with Portra to a certain extent. As for the cameras, Hasselblad or C220/C330? - I'd just get in touch with the photographers and ask.. :smile:

    Tim
     
  3. istillshootfilm

    istillshootfilm Member

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    My first thought was also Fuji Astia, with possible white balance adjustment either in printing or Photoshop. Another possibility could be Kodak Ektar, again with the yellow/red altered in post.

    A large portion of the color also comes from the fact that these images appear to be shot in overcast conditions....
     
  4. tony lockerbie

    tony lockerbie Subscriber

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    Can't help with the technique, but loved the images of the Gypsies.
     
  5. bsdunek

    bsdunek Subscriber

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    Great images. Hard to tell what film when it's on the web. Who knows how much Photoshop was used?
     
  6. Brian C. Miller

    Brian C. Miller Member

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    Why not just contact the photographer and ask?
     
  7. batwister

    batwister Member

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    Something people get confused about with colour is how, by simply being very selective with the frame, you can end up with surprising colour contrast in the same lighting conditions - even with Portra.

    But more importantly, you have to ask yourself whether the 'style' that you're seeing is actually the photographer's shooting aesthetic (his response to tonality, colour and lighting) or, whether there is something unique in the processing - magic bullet. In my eyes, there isn't, and what you're seeing is his own subjective and idiosyncratically personal sense of neutrality. It's very hard to imitate the way somebody else's brain processes colour! Straight photographers like this rely very much on intuition.

    The way we respond to colour at the actual shooting stage (surprising how many colour photographers don't actually see in colour) is about taste and aesthetic sensibility, but also intention with colour relationships (look up 'colour theory'). What strikes me about these pictures is the photographer's very subtle eye for colour - i.e. what is inherent in the scene. They are otherwise very, very straight and unaffected pictures. Very good too.

    The most important thing with colour is going out and developing a responsiveness and sensitivity to it, otherwise, due to its rabbit hole complexity, it can very easily become science. At which point you'll find that photography is very superficial. :smile:
     
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  8. Grinschus

    Grinschus Member

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    thanks for the answers

    as i know the agency and there tradition/rules/credo: definitly no photoshop...i dont even think they use scanners and if yes, just to digitalize the final prints

    batwister :
    i absolutly agree. You could say the same for light, btw.
    Thats why i am trying to archive these kind of contrast/colour and mix it up with my personal sense of "reality". At the moment i am not satisfied with my own postproduction. I dont even know if it is the postproduction. Even when i try to avoid photoshop there still remains a basic look of film...and that is a technical point you can not avoid :smile:
     
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  9. whowantstoast

    whowantstoast Member

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    Excellent insight, it's something photography has in common with all visual arts. In our desire to learn the form we tend to forget that we cannot separate the art from the artist. I'm still learning, and this is so often the difficult thing, to process and absorb great work while still striving for your own style.
     
  10. batwister

    batwister Member

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    What I've taken away most from the pictures - and I like them very much - is that the shooting aesthetic (his eye for tonality and colour in front of the camera) is more striking than the post processing/printing - which is very naturalistic and faithful. If you're into this kind of photography, the key is to look for colour in your subjects rather than trying to find it afterwards in the darkroom. Then your post work will be very simple.

    You might also like this photographer btw - http://www.celinette.com/ENG-index-maze.html
    Again, very naturalistic processing, but the photographer's eye for colour is bold.
     
  11. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    i never understand threads like this.
    while the best form of flattery some say is imitation,
    sometimes it is good just to not try to copy someone elses style
    because often times it is impossible.

    you could always call or write to the photographer/s to ask
    or instead you can just ... do your own thing ?

    too many people try to chase down someone else's magic ..
    then they realize there is no magic at all

    [video=youtube;YWyCCJ6B2WE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWyCCJ6B2WE[/video]
     
  12. Grinschus

    Grinschus Member

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    Thanks for the link. This photographer you postet batwister has a colour palette i want definitly to avoid, beaceause it is this typically ugly-lookin portra/fuji 400h rated at 400 -look you can find everywhere. This and next to it the: overexposure 2 stops - style" - and both things are in my eyes not good...the first ugly and realistic, the second more beautifull but absolut unrealistic...just my opinion...

    I absolutly agree with you. There has to be a nose for colours but we are still talking about things i already know. It is for sure, that both photographer have a sesibility for building up pictures with light, colours and finally emotions

    here an example for good colour sesibility you were talking about - from the first phtographer, too:
    http://www.ostkreuz.de/feature/432?fp=3&photographer=3&fi=18 (picture no. 9 - the guy in front of his car)

    In this case i exactly know, that shoting the same scene with any at the moment on the market available films, would give me not that look: strong colour AND pastellic with only deep blacks (higlights are so smooth) on a overcastet day. And everything is, like you already said batwister ,some how of naturalistic... but not the "sad/trist/puristic" and oversharped/clear way a modern provia produces, but aswell not to soft/unrealistic(in my opinion) you go with an fuji pro400/portra/reala/ektar...


    Here two another examples:

    http://www.ostkreuz.de/feature/432?fp=3&photographer=3&fi=18 (second picture)
    http://www.ostkreuz.de/feature/881?fp=2&photographer=3&fi=15 (8th picture)


    So: what do i wrong or how can i find this direction?
    I will post this evening some pictures of me.

    Best regards,

    luke


    edit: aswell i never understand posts like yours, njanian, how people can be that unconstructive: just posting to crizicze :smile:
     
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  13. batwister

    batwister Member

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    Well, you've defintely got me thinking there, as I shoot Portra 400 at 400 :wink: I'm of course aware nearly every other photographer uses it, but it's not something I'm self-conscious about.

    There are plenty of divergences to take in the darkroom/computer with the same source. So I don't think in terms of a 'Portra look', unless you mean Alec Soth et al. But, I'm so engrossed in Soth's pictures that I'm not thinking 'Portra... Portra, Definitely Portra.'. Even though they are like an advertisement for that film in many ways. As 'straight' as you can get.

    I guess it depends where your headspace is. You think of 'colour palette' as inherent in the film, where I think of it as inherent in the photographer. The colour responsiveness of the film is incidental in my mind - you shouldn't be thinking "Well, Ektar is good with reds, so I'll shoot this scene with that. Portra is great with blues, so I'll shoot this scene with that." Or like I said in my first post, you'll just end up down the rabbit hole.


    P.S. Ektar was still available at the time of this posting.
     
  14. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    suggesting you contact the people who you want to copy (as did someone else in this thread),
    and that i don't "get" people that just want to copy someone else's style instead of finding their own style ... is being unconstructive and critical ?

    :munch:

    sorry im not going to join in your guessing-game because that is unconstructive. if you want to develop your own style
    you need to pick up a camera and some film and use it, instead of guessing endlessly about someone else's work.

    if it is THAT important send the people and email...
    because (from personal experience) when people "guess" they are usually dead-wrong.
    nj
     
  15. Grinschus

    Grinschus Member

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    and again - just for you: this is not thread with a topic like "is it moralistic "okay" to go after someones style" or "how can i develope my style"...
    I already said what i am interested to and that is aswell not implicating to archive this style 1:1 but to get a trace.

    I already contacted the photographer but did not get an answer yet.

    Anyway: it is important for me. I am a Student of photography for 5 years now and looking for answers for my personal development i could not get by testing, our professors or something else you suggest. "picking up a camera/film and use it i do for a while now", but not long enough to grew up with a generation of only-film-users and their experience, aswell in a time of an offer of 30 colour films on the market. So please, if you have something to say according to this technical thread so let me know. Otherwise...
    Thank you :smile:

    @ i still shot film:

    Ektar is not working in this case: the skin colours are not accurate//neutral. I checked some Ilfochrome/astia prints of our school archive and it really seems to be not far from to this. Actually the fuji emulsion (provia 100/400) do not seem to get near and is a lot of harder in graduation. Kodak e100g print i could only found in internet :/
    I think it is really a slide-film both photographer use. Maybe even pushed as i suggested, but from what i saw on the prints i could even imagine astia had a low graduation. It is a pitty i wont get the chance to try out or use this film( ebay prices are not payabe)
     
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  16. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    perhaps you need to read what i wrote: i don't get it ... has nothing to do with morals.

    find EXPIRED film and shoot it, not fresh stuff. that is why you can't find what you are looking for.

    i certainly hope you are less obnoxious to your professors.
     
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  17. chuck94022

    chuck94022 Subscriber

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    Wow, this is feeling more and more like a candidate for the Lounge...