Bad News About Ilford

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by geraldatwork, Aug 23, 2004.

  1. geraldatwork

    geraldatwork Member

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  2. clay

    clay Subscriber

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  3. philldresser

    philldresser Subscriber

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    Ouch! This is a sad day in my book

    Phill
     
  4. wiseowl

    wiseowl Member

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    Mmmm, a sad day indeed. Lets hope someone steps in.
     
  5. Jorge

    Jorge Inactive

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    Jand C, here I come! Sadly I get the feeling this will also affect photowarehouse film.

    OTOH, I dont know why anybody is surprised. I pointed this out a few months back in another thread. The moment they changed the name Ilford "gallerie" from a traditional paper to a digital paper, their intention was very clear regardless of what the suits said to the public.

    It will be interesting to see who buys it, who knows maybe someone who will want to make ULF film as well as different sizes film will do so, and this in fact might be a blessing for us.
     
  6. Francesco

    Francesco Member

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    You won't regret it Jorge.
     
  7. Eric Rose

    Eric Rose Subscriber

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    F%$K!
     
  8. Thomassauerwein

    Thomassauerwein Member

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    Double F%$k I'm just getting the hang of delta 100 after losing Agfa 25. This just really stinks! Maybe it's time to stock up.
     
  9. Eric Rose

    Eric Rose Subscriber

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    I think Les should buy Ilford!
     
  10. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    I'm told by reliable suppliers who stock a variety of manufacturers B&W films & papers that other distributors have in fact hastened the drop in sales by drastically reducing their stock on shelves.

    A sad day for Ilford, But after all another large EEC company is also trying to divest itself of it traditional photography arm.

    New technology - digital takes over but at a far higher price - to us the photographers. Inkjet papers containing no silver actually cost more and we are totally ripped off.

    Meanwhile traditional silver based image making goes on. Even in a greatly shrinking market there is a demand. Even if all the major manufacturers stopped silver based imaging someone woul buy some of their coating machines and manufacture to fill the demand.

    It's a time of shake up & survive
     
  11. Tom Duffy

    Tom Duffy Member

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    Clay pretty much sums it up. On one level I expect someone to survive after the all fallout. Ironic if it's Kodak, which I alway thought would be second to go, after Agfa.

    These things seem to happen very precipitously in Britain. I was in London, on business, when BMW shut down Rover in the course of a day, with no warning to anyone. Tony Blair was about to have a cow...
     
  12. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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    Time to take a John Coffer workshop. Want to repeat the workshop with me Clay? I just got my camera today. I have an order in for the portable darkroom. Now to experiment with the albumen prints.

    My favorite film was apfa 25, then verichorme pan, I settled finally on Ilford FP4. I see a trend here.

    Personally I think EricR should get the Ilford equipment and set it up in Costa Rica as a retirement trade. Make a good OLD AGE type supplemental income. In expensive labor force, and condusive overhead costs once the machinery is there. Just have to watch out for hurricanes and volcanos.
     
  13. clay

    clay Subscriber

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    There is no doubt that I'm glad I'm learning how to 'make' my own film with wet plate. I already feel relatively independent for the printing side since I print mostly in platinum and gum. I don't think you can take too many wet plate workshops because I am beginning to think that every practictioner has their own peculiar way of working.

    But film is still going to be something I want to use. Hand held cameras, night photography and other things would be impossible with wet plate. The effective film speed is somewhere around ISO 1!
     
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  15. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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    Robb Kendrick said he would do a workshop if I came to Texas. What do you think of that as a workshop? William Duniway lives next to my brother in law in So Cal. So I will be hitting just a few of them.
     
  16. John McCallum

    John McCallum Member

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    'tis a d#mn shame!

    However, there have been pretty extreme circumstances working against them - considering the exchange rate and massive surge in digital sales over the last couple of yrs. I don't think these two circumstances are likely to continue in tandem indefinately.

    There's some hope in their quote ....
    “The rumour last week was we were going to be bought by a German firm. We’ve been told nothing definite yet, it’s a case of wait and see.”
     
  17. mark

    mark Member

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    G&D DA*N IT!

    How long can you freeze film? I was just going to order some delta 100 and cut it to 5x7.
     
  18. Andre R. de Avillez

    Andre R. de Avillez Member

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    As I sit and watch film companies go the way of the Buffalo, I wonder:

    Isn't film nescessary for fine circuitry manufacturing? I might be mistaken, but I believe it is.
    If so, what will happen if major film manufacturers go out (maybe a far fetched idea, maybe not)? Will the eletronics giants switch to smaller film companies? Will they keep their emulsions alive and nothing else? Will we stop making computers?

    True, this might be a bit off the top, but it's my train of thought.

    Am I that wrong?
     
  19. clay

    clay Subscriber

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    Two other rays of hope here:
    1) the movie industry still consumes a hell of a lot of film. Even the digital flics are eventually made into film. Sooner or later of course, the industry will switch to digital projection systems, but the cost of re-tooling would be enormous. The industry has some large fixed investments in the form of projection, and the cost advantage to justify a switch would likewise have to be pretty large.
    2) Microfilm is still the preferred method for long term archiving of data. We know how long microfilm is good for, which can't be said with some of the magnetic digital storage methods.

    I'm guessing 35mm film will be the last to go, and ULF sheet film the first to go. Get a freezer, and learn to shoot without bracketing!
     
  20. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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    Also all crime labs have to use film since the negative may be inspected. Digital is not allowed in court cases, since you can't tell if it has been manipulated.
     
  21. Andre R. de Avillez

    Andre R. de Avillez Member

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    Good points, but just to play the devil's advocate:

    I wonder if any of that applies, once we are talking about shareholders. The markets we pointed out are still (probably) minorites when compared to consumer/amateur/professional photography; most of which have gone digital.

    To shareholders, money talks, and usually on a short timeline, with blinders on. Please forgive my prejudices :smile:
     
  22. Nige

    Nige Subscriber

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    As a long time Ilford supporter this is sad news.

    We recently bought a digicam to see how that fitted in with our household (my wife averages over 40 rolls of colour a year, 85-90% of the 6x4 prints go in albums, which believe it or not, both we and the kids look at regularly). After a few months of filling the memory card, uploading to PC then editing (deleting the shockers), we haven't looked at the pics, 'backed' them up to CD or even got any printed. At the moment I can't see myself getting enthused with this workflow once B&W film goes the way of the Dodo. I suspect someone will continue to make B&W film and I'll try to support them. We have two suppliers here in Aust that I'll be confident of continuing to import film. Either that or C-41 here we come! hmm, will Ilford contine to make XP2? I did buy a few bricks of APX-25 when that went belly up, but I don't think I'll do the same (which would have to be in much larger quanities) when the mainstream B&W manufacturers call it quits as that would just hasten the demise of the small players in the market. Buying from them now will keep them interested in make a few bucks, rather than the giants who need to make big bucks or move their capital into other areas they think they'll prosper.

    As a silent protest, I won't buy anymore Ilford inkjet paper... (which is only a couple of packets a year) Bugger 'em!
     
  23. voceumana

    voceumana Member

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    A couple of generations lost their family snapshots when the masses switched to color film in the 1960's. So far the only archival medium for photos is black & white silver based photography.

    Police work, as mentioned, and x-rays seem to still require silver emulsion.

    A sad day, indeed.

    Charlie
     
  24. argentic

    argentic Member

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    A friend of mine is a police photographer. He uses digital exclusively now.

    Last time my daughter had an X-Ray made, it was all digital. Ready and printed on transparent plastic in about five minutes. And a copy for ourselves was printed even faster.

    G.
     
  25. noblebeast

    noblebeast Member

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    Maybe Ilford will see the wisdom in moving to a smaller factory and limiting the production of its films and papers (because I really love PanF+). If it (the film and paper division) pays for its own costs of running, and even turns a small -or large- profit, it could keep going for quite a while.

    Still, that won't prevent hundreds of people from losing their jobs. And I think, just for a moment's break from all our pissing and moaning, we should think about those people for a second or two and the impact this possible dark day will have upon them and their families.

    Joe
     
  26. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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    Courts are throwing out evidence that is not film based. Maybe internally the shots are digital at a police department, but for court room evidence it has to be film. But I see you are in the netherlands. May be different there.