changing shutter speeds, before or after cocking shutter?

Discussion in 'Medium Format Cameras and Accessories' started by puketronic, Jul 5, 2012.

  1. puketronic

    puketronic Member

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    I'm confused because for some cameras it is better to cock the shutter, then change the shutter speed and for other cameras it is better to do the opposite. Is there a generalization for which cameras require cocking the shutter before or after changing the shutter speed? Like leaf shutters, focal plane shutters, etc. Or is it just a case by case basis. I believe that for Kiev's, doing it the wrong way will break your camera but many other cameras it doesn't really matter so much. Not sure what the best practice is... A good rule will be easier, but the particular cameras that I'm concerned about are:

    MF:
    Bronica SQA
    Hasselblad 500CM
    Pentacon Six
    Rolleiflex C,D,E

    35mm:
    Leica M
    Olympus OM
     
  2. Leigh B

    Leigh B Member

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    I can't think of any shutter that must be changed in the un-cocked condition.

    If you think about it, that would make it impossible to change exposure without exposing a frame.

    - Leigh
     
  3. dehk

    dehk Member

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    Case by case basis.
     
  4. BradS

    BradS Subscriber

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    everything I've read, even from manufacturers literature, says that it does not matter for modern shutters. (where modern is taken to mean post 1945 or so).

    Certainly, EVERY modern 35mm SLR with a coupled meter MUST allow the shutter speed to be changed when the shutter is cocked.
     
  5. BrianShaw

    BrianShaw Member

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    good rule: If the shutter speed dial turns to another speed when cocked then it is OK. If the shutter speed dial needs to be forced when trying to turn the shutter speed dial, then it is not OK... for whatever reason.
     
  6. Slixtiesix

    Slixtiesix Subscriber

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    If I remember correctly, with pre-war(!) Rolleis you had to set the 1/500sec only when the shutter was uncocked.
     
  7. R.Gould

    R.Gould Member

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    With all older Rolleiflex cameras, that is, those using the Compur shutter, you set the 500 before cocking the shutter, they have a lock on them to prevent you settong he 500 with the shutter cocked, on general terms with the older compur and prontor shutter it is better to change shutter speeds with the shutter uncocked, and with the English Epsilon shutters never ever try and change fro 25 to 15 with a cocked shuter, serious damage can be done to that shutter, with modern electronic shutters such as fitted to the bronica then you must have the shutter cocked at all times so changing speeds with the shutter cocked is not a problem,and I would think that applies to other modern shutters, s to sum up, with German clockwork it is in advisable to change shutter speeds with the shutter cocked, with modern electronic shutters then no problem, at leastwith leaf shutters
     
  8. DWThomas

    DWThomas Subscriber

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    The Bronica SQ-A has an electronically timed shutter and can be changed any time. I believe some early (pre-WWII) folders had problems with the highest speeds engaging some special mechanism that jammed if moved while cocked. I think Brian Shaw's answer pretty well covers it.
     
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  9. E. von Hoegh

    E. von Hoegh Member

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    That's a feature of the Compur Rapid shutters, also Compur 1 shutters and a few others. Setting the shutter to it's highest speed brought an auxiliary spring into play, setting the speed before cocking the shutter reduced wear. Compound shutters should be set before cocking, regardless of the speed.
     
  10. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    Some pre-WWII cameras needed the shutter speed set before it was re-cocked, and I think it's the same with some Russian Leica copies, this is to do with the tensioning of two blinds and consistency of the shutter speeds

    It really depends on the camera, for instance with a TP Ruby reflex whenyou cock the shutter that sets the first curtain and tensions the second but you then adjust the shutter speed which sets the sit width between the two curtains.

    With many older SLR's ideally you should set the shutter speed first it is possible to damage some shutters making changes after cocking with some models. I just remembered that the shutter speed dial can only be adjusted in one direction on some Russian SLRs as well.

    In addition older Compur's can only be set (or unset) to the fastest shutter speed before cocking the shutter and some say shutters should be stored uncocked not that I've ever found it makes a difference.

    Ian
     
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  11. Richard S. (rich815)

    Richard S. (rich815) Subscriber

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    My 2.8C Xenotar is like that. My E, E2 and E3's no...
     
  12. Sirius Glass

    Sirius Glass Subscriber

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    Hasselblad has always said to store the lenses on or off the camera cocked. That would imply that one can change the shutter speed after cocking the lens.
     
  13. 250swb

    250swb Member

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    I always thought that was to keep the lens and body in sync, but it is a long long time since I had a Hasselblad!

    To back up what others have said the general advice for pre and post war folders with any type of shutter is to be on the safe side change the speed before cocking the shutter. This is particularly so with cheaper copies like the Moskva.

    Steve
     
  14. benjiboy

    benjiboy Subscriber

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    The main thing is to learn to not worry about it :smile:
     
  15. T-grain

    T-grain Member

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    well, it depends on the case:blink:

    in some of the Soviet-era cameras, like the Zorkis or FED, you can change shutter settings only AFTER the shutter has been cocked!
    probably that's true also for the pre-war Leicas, since the Soviet cameras were basically Leica copies, but IDK for sure
     
  16. tessar

    tessar Subscriber

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    The shutter speeds on all screwmount (Barnack) Leicas, up to and including the IIIg, have to be changed after the shutter has been cocked.
     
  17. xxloverxx

    xxloverxx Member

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    From the few cameras I've used: if you have to lift the shutter wheel to change speeds (eg screwmount Leica) , best do it after cocking. If you don't need to lift it, it should be okay either way (M Leica).
    If it's a leaf shutter, set highest speeds before cocking.

    If you feel more resistance than normal, stop. It's relative though – Kiev RFs seem to be stiffer than Zorkis or FEDs.
     
  18. RalphLambrecht

    RalphLambrecht Subscriber

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    interesting, i can't think of any that can't!
     
  19. luibargi

    luibargi Member

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  20. George Collier

    George Collier Member

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    Then, with a Rollei requiring setting before cocking, you can't advance the film either, if you are moving locations and don't know what you will need. ?? Am I missing something here?
     
  21. JerseyDoug

    JerseyDoug Member

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    That's right. With my Rollei Automat I (1) set the aperture, (2) set the shutter speed, (3) advance the film and (4) make the exposure. To avoid confusing myself, I do the same thing with my Rollei MX-EVS even though it isn't necessary.