Dbl Wt. Printing paper without emulsion?

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by mikewhi, Sep 8, 2004.

  1. mikewhi

    mikewhi Member

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    Hi:

    Does anyone know of a source to get heavy dbl weight printing paper (in at least 8x10) without an emulsion on it? Sizing would be ok, but no emulsion. I do believe that I have seen this for sale somewhere a few times but I can't remember where. I'm looking for standard b&w double-weight printing paper with no emulsion.

    Thanks.

    -Mike
     
  2. Les McLean

    Les McLean Subscriber

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    Would 360gsm water colour art paper do the job, if so any good art supplier will have it.
     
  3. mikewhi

    mikewhi Member

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    Not sure. I'm looking for as little surface texture as possible and b&w printing paper seems very smooth to me. I'll go take a look, though, but it's the texture that I want to avoid.

    -Mike
     
  4. glbeas

    glbeas Member

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    If you had the time and inclination you could find some outdated DW paper and fix it out, wash it, and dry it so you could have some to try out. Probably would be easier to find too.
     
  5. Les McLean

    Les McLean Subscriber

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    Mike if you look for hot press art paper it is generally quite smooth although I have to say not so smooth as a matt paper such as Ilford semi matt warmtone.
     
  6. mikewhi

    mikewhi Member

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    Clever, I had thought of doing that if I can't find what I need. I'm sure that I saw it in some internet store's inventory at some point, just can't recall where\when.....
     
  7. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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    just hit Daniel Smith in Seattle
     
  8. jborden

    jborden Member

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  9. glbeas

    glbeas Member

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    Craig Koshyk produced a little book on hand coating fixed out baryta paper for alt processes. I was lucky enought to get a copy but have not had time to try out the processes. He claims to be able to get an astounding Dmax but the process is tricky, hence writing the manual.
    What are you planning to try?
     
  10. mikewhi

    mikewhi Member

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    I am planning on: "hand coating fixed out baryta paper for alt processes"!!!

    Actually, I was hoping to not have to fix it out, but I'll give it a try. Wonder what's tricky about it - getting all the chemicals out properly?

    I found an old post from him with a dead link to this topic. His e-mail also returns unknown. Any idea how to get hold of him? I'd like to get a copy of that booklet if at all possible.

    Thanks for the lead!

    -Mike
     
  11. fhovie

    fhovie Subscriber

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    My favorites are Stonhenge Rising and Cranes Plainotype - I would think one could get some severly outdated paper off e-bay and fix it out if he wanted to keep the emulsion but loose the silver.
     
  12. glbeas

    glbeas Member

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    The book makes it out to be the coating step that is the tricky part, that and the fact the paper will absorb a lot of sensitiser. He also said the wash probably needs to be longer. Theres slightly different techniques for glossy and matte paper in the coating too. When you get to your trial runs pm me and I'll share what Ican from the book if you can't get on yourself.
     
  13. mikewhi

    mikewhi Member

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  14. mikewhi

    mikewhi Member

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    I have a few boxes of old Kodak Elite, which was a very heavy triple weight paper so I'll try that out first......
     
  15. gainer

    gainer Subscriber

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    Get some outdated photo paper and remove the emulsion. Clorox will do it nicely and completely. It takes off gelatin and all.
     
  16. Donald Miller

    Donald Miller Member

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  17. Annie

    Annie Member

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    Stripped Photographic Papers For Platinum Printing

    Mike,

    I have tested Platinum Printing on various photographic papers with the emulsion removed...

    - results will vary from paper to paper... I have tried Agfa Classic, Kodak PX CD, Ilford MGFB, & Bergger (J&C).
    - Kodak papers have problems with inconsistency in the coating & bleedback.
    - Ilford, intermittent blotching... Under magnification this paper has uneven surface fibres that interfere with image sharpness.
    - I found the Bergger (J&C) papers far superior to all others in terms of paper base colour, ease of coating, attainable Dmax, and most importantly .... sharpness of image detail.
    - The papers seem to have a 'right' side (I clip one corner to identify)
    - Double coating with these papers does make a significant difference.

    A few things to consider when stripping emulsions...

    - Wear gloves and do the emulsion removal outdoors ...the process releases some very nasty toxic fumes!
    - I used a dilution of about 2:1 bleach to water. The gentle use of a soft SYNTHETIC brush will make the removal process go faster without damaging the paper surface. If you use something like a hake the bleach will dissolve the fibres.
    - Keep a bucket handy when doing batches as the solution will exhaust itself and accumulate the clay base which you do not want to reintroduce to the paper (will cause bleedback and reduced Dmax).
    - I washed the paper for about an hour after the bleach (it is important to ensure all the clay is rinsed out as well as the bleach....bleach eats paper, clay kills Dmax) and then gave an oxalic soak to get the pH back up to where it should be. You may want to do the gelatine thing as well.

    I believe that for a high key image rendered with delicacy of tone and sharpness of detail the stripped Bergger is absolutely sublime. I found that using fixed out paper had an assortment of problems including attaining evenness of coating (even with a surficant) and effective clearing.

    Also there is always the option of fixing out the paper and just using the backside.

    Hope this helps..... Annie