Developing 4x5' negs

Discussion in 'Darkroom Equipment' started by jansenh, May 14, 2003.

  1. jansenh

    jansenh Member

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    Hello all!

    With absolutely NO previous experience with LF I am about to buy a tank /developing system for 4x5 inchs negatives. (Yes, I have a LF camera, I got it last week - a neat Linhof Technica III with a few lenses...65, 90 & 150mm)

    So far I have been looking at a Combiplan tank which seems like an easy contraption to use...

    And then I got confronted with a second hand Jobo 3014 tank. Anyone know this system, and if it is a better system than the Combiplan?

    Anyone
     
  2. Robert

    Robert Member

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    I went down this road. Trying to figure out what to buy. This is what I learned from listening to everybodies opinions.

    1) Stay away from the Yankee tank. If you're offered money to take it make sure it's alot of money-))

    2) The HP tank works but does it work the way you do? It uses lots of chemicals. If you don't use dilute developer this might be an issue. It fils/drains slowly. Once again this might be an issue. One person told me he bought three tanks!. What he does is open the tank and move the film holder instead of draining.

    3) The Jobo 2500 tank is what I got. It can be expensive. The Jobo processors can't handle alot of dilute developer. Check the limits on the Jobo website. It's claimed that you can use them for hand inversion but thatt will take alot of chemicals. What I did was get a motorbase instead of an expensive Jobo processor. Handles lots of chemicals.

    http://www.largeformatphotography.info/unicolor/

    My system is similar to this except I use the Jobo tanks.

    The other advantage for me is I needed to get a bigger tank for 120/35 also.

    4) the Jobo 3000 tanks. Damn things are really expensive when I looked. Supposedly do a better job then the 2500 in the opinion of some. I doubt you'll be able to use them without some sort of motor.
     
  3. Les McLean

    Les McLean Subscriber

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    I'm a great fan of the Phil Davis BTZS Tubes. They are expensive to buy but very efficient and inexpensive to run. I have also used Jobo, Combi Tanks and tray development but in my opinion none are better than the tubes.
     
  4. Ole

    Ole Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    I have a JOBO 2500-series tank which I use whenever I have lots of negatives to develop. Using it by inversion is not really a problem, as I generally use highly dilute developer. 1.5 liters is not too much for 6 sheets...

    Most of my processing is done in trays. I have discovered that my darkroom isn't quite dark, so that I can generally see the outline of my hands after six minutes or so. Then it's just waiting for the first traces of highlights to be visible on the sheets... It's possible I get some fogging this way, but I have not been able to see (or measure) any difference in base+fog on tray-developed versus tank-developed negatives. So far. But then again I've used nothing faster than FP4+ so far, it may be a different matter with HP5+...
     
  5. c6h6o3

    c6h6o3 Member

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    Les-

    Does Phil Davis has a web presence where I can get more info on the tubes you mention? If not, how do I get in touch with him?

    Thanks.

    Jim
     
  6. Jorge

    Jorge Inactive

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    All of the BTZS products are marketed by the view camera store. You can get the tubes, the hood and the expo developer programs from Fred Newman. If you have questions about the BTZS method you can go to the BTZS web site and get an answer straight from Phil. Here are the links.

    http://www.viewcamerastore.com

    and for the BTZS questions:

    http://www.BTZS.org
     
  7. Les McLean

    Les McLean Subscriber

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    Thanks Jorge you beat me to it.
     
  8. Loose Gravel

    Loose Gravel Member

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    Didn't I read, somewhere long ago, that an inexpensive and similar to the BTZS tubes ( I don't know about this, I've never used the tubes ) was the use a piece of PVC pipe cut to length and open on both ends. The film was inserted and rolled around in a tray of developer, stop, fix, etc. Since it is open, it had to be done in total darkness. Therefore, it is like tray development, but the film can't get scratched and it is easier to give individual sheets special attention, if need be.

    It would work for all sizes of film and was very cheap. Does this ring any bells, anyone?

    Closer to the topic, I use a 3000 series Jobo tank on a motor base. Works very well, but if I were just getting started I wouldn't recommend the expense.
     
  9. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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  10. Jorge

    Jorge Inactive

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    Loose, originally Phil Dvais created the tubes as you explained out of PVC pipe and two end caps. Of course the VCS tubes are really nice, with threaded caps etc.
    To answer your question, yes the tubes can be made by PVC pipe but it has to be at least schedule 80 as the schedule 40 transmits light through the walls. Obviously using the white pvc pipe would be dumb!
     
  11. c6h6o3

    c6h6o3 Member

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    Aggie-

    Can you post a link? I can't find any 'used' section on either the Jobo U.S.A or Jobo International sites. Thanks.

    Jim
     
  12. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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  13. Robert

    Robert Member

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    </span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Aggie @ May 14 2003, 12:52 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Great news. GO DIRECTLY TO THE JOBO SITE. do not pass go. click on their used equipment. scroll down and guess what. Brand new 4341.1 single reel SF kit. It contains the loader, tank, and reel. The full kit. PRICE! becasue the box is damaged it was 53.71 usd. Now that is a savings anyway you look at it. I just bought mine from them. Hope you see this before you buy. </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
    Aggie just one downside. The tank is too small for a motorbase. I still don't think it's a good setup for inversion. When I measured it's just about full when you cover the reels with solution.

    If you want to use it with a processor then the single reel tank should be just perfect.

    If you need to use a motorbase then look for a six reel extension tank. It converts the tank you get in the kit into a eight reel tank. Either that or get the five reel tank. The five reel tank is actually more money. The extension reel uses your lid.

    http://www.jobo-usa.com/products/used.htm

    thats the link for used stuff. Some is used some is NOS.
     
  14. David Hall

    David Hall Member

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    If you're not going to do it in trays, and you don't want to or can't spend a couple hundred bucks for a Jobo Expert drum, then the 2500 series tanks are the way to go.

    I started with the Yankee thing. The streaking was so bad I think I was using the combi-plan tank within two weeks. The unevenness was bad, and I just couldn't load the thing easily, so after another month or so I had the 2500 tank. That's a dream compared to the others.

    I now use an Expert drum on a Beseler motor base because it's much easier to load than the others, allows me to be much more consistent with the process, and because the times are shorter for rotation agitation there is less temperature change during the process. AND I can use it over and over again when it's wet. I now can do 10 sheets in 36 minutes, 20 sheets in 50 minutes, and 30 sheets in 80 minutes from holders to dryer. I was never able to work so fast or so consistently with the other systems. But it is pricey, so the 2500 system is a good alternative.

    dgh
     
  15. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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  16. MikeK

    MikeK Member

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    I like the Jobo tanks and can vouch for the 2521 which will process 6 sheets of 4x5 and my favorite the 2551 which enables me to process up to 12 sheets of 4x5 or a combination of 4x5 and 120 roll and 35mm. I used it on a roller base until I got my CPE 2Plus.

    Jobo also makes, or used to make a manual roller base for the 2521 and it worked just fine and being able to develop 6 sheets of 4x5 in 560ml of developer is very economic.

    Mike
     
  17. fhovie

    fhovie Subscriber

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    Get the Jobo kit - it is the only way to go. The Yankee square tank is VERY expensive. I wasted a month and a box of film before I gave it the heave ho!. Save the month and the film and do it right once. -Frank
     
  18. fparnold

    fparnold Member

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    On a related note, will their "Jobo Colorbase" manual system accomodate the 2500 series sheet film tanks? I've been wandering around the darkroom hand-twisting mine while chanting, but thought some sort of stationary apparatus, even if I had to hand-crank it, was finally in order.
     
  19. Robert

    Robert Member

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    </span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (fparnold @ May 15 2003, 10:45 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> On a related note, will their &quot;Jobo Colorbase&quot; manual system accomodate the 2500 series sheet film tanks? I've been wandering around the darkroom hand-twisting mine while chanting, but thought some sort of stationary apparatus, even if I had to hand-crank it, was finally in order. </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
    I'm not sure but here is the math.

    You can buy the colorbase without it's motor for about $40 from Jobo site

    Or you can buy a motorbase from Ebay for something between $10-30. Plug it into a timer.

    If you're tank is big enough to fit the motorbase I know which way I'd go-))

    If you search on the Jobo website for motorbases they have a small page telling you what to look for.
     
  20. chrisl

    chrisl Member

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    Something I'll consider is either Jobo tank, the 2500 or expert, on my Unicolor motor instead of these Unicolor drums if I can't get the leaking fixed. Going to try some silicon and let set, then unscrew and see if that forms a new gasket. It's a pain when they leak. I can see why one would spend more money on a nicer Jobo tank.

    Chris
     
  21. MikeK

    MikeK Member

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    Trick with the gasket. Take it out very carefully and soak it in really hot water. It will soften and expand getting rid of any little kinks etc, and hopefully make a better seal for you.

    This little trick worked for me. Which was good as replacement seals are like gold dust.

    Mike
     
  22. Jeremy

    Jeremy Member

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    The hot water really does work! Mine was leaking and after a quick minute in hot water the seal was back into the tube and held 500mL of liquid w/o leaking for 15 minutes.
     
  23. Tom Perkins

    Tom Perkins Member

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    I have a Jobo 2500 series tank, two reels and a loader that I'm not using, as I upgraded to a 3006; if you are interested, please feel free to contact me privately
     
  24. Eric Rose

    Eric Rose Subscriber

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    I use 4 tupperware containers that cost $1 each. They are deep enough for my 4x5 hangers and I can process 8 sheets at once.

    When I'm done I just snap the lids on them and the chemicals are kept nice and fresh for next time.

    Don't have to worry about the electricity going off in the middle of my development.

    Eric