Did something stupid

Discussion in 'Darkroom Equipment' started by Ashfaque, Jul 21, 2014.

  1. Ashfaque

    Ashfaque Member

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    Hello Everyone,

    I think I may have just ruined 17 meter bulk roll of HP5 Plus - at least some of it. When I opened the cardboard box, I saw the black plastic bag in which the roll stays. It is my first experience with bulk rolls. I was expecting the black plastic thingy will be sealed. Instead it was simply folded. But me being like a curious cat, peeked inside thinking that, may be, there is another layer of protection inside! Suddenly I thought I better not whilst noticing the white tap quite briefly that holds the roll together (less than half a second). Have I ruined the whole role? :sad:

    Could you please share any strategy I should follow to check the film whilst putting them into cassettes - minimum frames per cassette, how many cassette should I try before finally throwing it away (, which I hope is not the case), etc.

    I am really annoyed with myself. grrr. :sad:

    Thanks for reading.

    Bests

    Ashfaque
     
  2. cliveh

    cliveh Subscriber

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    Put it down to a learning experience and move on.
     
  3. richard ide

    richard ide Member

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    Throw out the first five or so turns and then develop a couple of feet. With a little luck you may just have blackened the edge of the rest. Do not ask me how I know.
     
  4. John Koehrer

    John Koehrer Subscriber

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    Hey! I did that once.

    I was quite annoyed too. Guess I was spoiled with Kodak putting tape on their can.
     
  5. paul_c5x4

    paul_c5x4 Subscriber

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    You will have certainly fogged the first few feet. If you are real lucky, maybe just the outer edges further in on the roll. Try taking a few inches from the center of the roll and developing it to see if it has fogged. Bin the first few feet from the outside and try developing another snip.
     
  6. whlogan

    whlogan Subscriber

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    Yes, we know. Oh, and welcome to the club. Your initiation is now complete. There is a secret list of other screw-ups you are required to complete over the years. You will know when you have completed them and are advanced to the next level, Re-doing the same levels or ones looking for extra credit is not permitted or accepted. Screw-ups may be completed in any order we suggest you accomplish the easy ones first. Good luck and have fun, we all do and are still working on our lists, each and every one of us, and I mean EVERY ONE OF US.
    Logan
     
  7. NedL

    NedL Subscriber

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    Opening different kinds of film boxes in the dark is a funny thing... you have to trust that you'll be able to figure out what's in it and how to open it by feel alone. I've got a couple of boxes of sheet film that I know what the insides feel like, but not what they look like. I too was temped to peek in the Ilford bulk roll box, and was glad I didn't when I opened it in the dark and felt the folded plastic bag.
     
  8. Ashfaque

    Ashfaque Member

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    Richard & Paul: Thanks for the suggestions.

    Any other suggestions? Since I have rodinal, which is relatively lot cheaper, I'm thinking of using it. Please let me if I should be doing anything special to possibly compensate for my initial mistake.

    Any other potential screw-ups I should be aware of. FYI, I have Rollei bulk rolls (Retro 80s, RPX ) and will be buying some Ilford and Kodak bulk rolls later.

    Bests,

    Ashfaque
     
  9. Alex Muir

    Alex Muir Member

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    I would be careful about handling Retro 80s. I have only bought it in 35mm cassettes before, and not bulk, but it seems to be prone to fogging. I now take the cassettes from their containers, and load/unload the camera in a changing bag. I don't know if others have had similar fogging issues with this film.
    Alex
     
  10. Ashfaque

    Ashfaque Member

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    Thanks for the tip, Alex. Although it is written on top of the bulk 'open in subdued light', I will follow your advice - just to minimize the risk.

    @Logan: what other screw ups... please share! :smile:

    I forgot to mention which RPX films - RPX 25 and RPX 400. On both bulks it is written 'open in darkroom only'. Oh well...

    Bests,

    Ashfaque
     
  11. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    ashfaque:

    just chalk it up to experience :wink:

    you can use that exposed film to test your fixer, all is not completely lost :wink:
     
  12. Neal

    Neal Subscriber

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    Dear Ashfaque,

    There is actually a decent chance you can use the film. The film is tightly coiled and the anti-halation layer will certainly have provided some protection. As others have advised, take off a length (I suggest enough for a 36 exposure roll) and develop it.

    Good luck,

    Neal Wydra
     
  13. Xmas

    Xmas Member

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    No remove 2 meter discard.
    The remained will be ok.
     
  14. Ashfaque

    Ashfaque Member

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    @ jnanian, Neal and xmas: Thanks for your tips. Even though it harts, somehow this experience is already making me smile. :smile:

    Re testing the fixer: sounds interesting, could you pleaee elaborate.

    Bests,

    Ashfaque
     
  15. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    well, you takw a small piece about 1 square inch ...
    and you put it in your fresh unused fixer with the lights on and time how long
    it takes to be completely clear. you fix your film for 2x that clear time ... so if it was 30 seconds, you
    fix your film for 1 min ... when you do your test and it takes 1 min to clear to film base ...
    your fixer is spent and it is time to dispose of it and make a fresh batch ...
    if you do 2 fix bath fixing .. you split the total fix time between 2 baths and when the first bath is spent
    and used up, you dispose of IT, make a fresh bath and make that fresh bath number 2 and the older #2 becomes your first batch ... then you do another " film clip test" and figure out the fix time all over again. :smile:

    have fun !

    john
     
  16. Trask

    Trask Subscriber

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    I was thinking of buying some Ilford 35mm film in bulk -- it doesn't come in a can?? They rely on the box and the rigidity of the tight roll of film to prevent crushing/denting/etc to the film itself?
     
  17. Ashfaque

    Ashfaque Member

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    John: Thanks a lot for the tutorial on fixer testing. :smile:

    I'm afraid, the paper box and the unsealed black plastic bag is all you get from Ilford for film packaging (+ a bit of paper tape that's holding the film together) - at least for 17 meters bulk roll of HP5 Plus!

    Bests,

    Ashfaque
     
  18. Xmas

    Xmas Member

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    Confirmed and also true for 30.5m packs.
    They used to use metal cans still have a HP4 can.

    The last Kentmere pack even omits the eight language warning to only open in dark.

    You need to be aware that fixing time is dependent.

    On film type - the delta/tabular films take 2x the time
    On temperature - aeons below 15C

    Ditto wash time - aeons below 15C

    Good to have another bulk user, cine is next step...
     
  19. John Koehrer

    John Koehrer Subscriber

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    Unfortunately the screw-ups are confidential and admittance to the inner circle is a journey of discovery
     
  20. Ashfaque

    Ashfaque Member

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    Xmas: Thanks for the information. They should at least make those plastic bags sealed => fool-proof!

    John: I'm just a poor student. The lower the number of screw-ups. the better. :smile:

    Bests,

    Ashfaque
     
  21. paul_c5x4

    paul_c5x4 Subscriber

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    Evolution => better fool. :tongue:

    Don't worry, you have plenty of years ahead of you to make all kinds of mistakes. The main thing is to learn from them, and also learn from the mistakes of others.
     
  22. Sirius Glass

    Sirius Glass Subscriber

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    Wot he said.
     
  23. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    The packaging for things now days is becoming quit cheap. Remembering back when film came in those cool metal cans as a added protection. Those days are over.

    Todd
     
  24. dances_w_clouds

    dances_w_clouds Subscriber

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    Another person had the same problem recently and he only destroyed the first 5' or so. It is always wound so tight there is little damage. Might be difficult to remove the last few ft from the inside of the roll. The best is just remove 10' or so then test. Here is a photo of the outcome of the damaged roll as you can see very little was destroyed. The edges are toast but make sure you don't use the first 20' for anything important. After that you should be fine.
    . View attachment 91651
     
  25. scheimfluger_77

    scheimfluger_77 Subscriber

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    I've used the Retro 80s in my 2.25 pinhole and gotten nice results. In case you didn't know, this film is extended red sensitivity. It falls off sharply at 720nm though so it's fairly slow. Could be the fogging was IR related.