E6 How hard/cheap is it ? !Seldom serious post!

Discussion in 'Color: Film, Paper, and Chemistry' started by Soeren, Nov 17, 2005.

  1. Soeren

    Soeren Member

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    I went back and read some of the old threads regarding the subject.
    I saw that Ole started doing E6 himself, how is it ?
    According to some of the posts its a piece of cake according to others its not for everybody, what to believe ?
    Well the reason for all this is the fact that I am doing quite soem chromes in 35mm and there is a possibility I will in LF too, that is when I get to that. So researching the economy in LF before stepping up I found that one slide 4X5, or whatever, is the same price at the lab as a 35mm or 120 film (7$]. Doing the stuff myself should cost 1/9 of that in chemistry, now that looks reasonable :smile:
    Next thought was, should I buy a CPE-2 with lifter to gain more control and comfort then maybe do all the LF devs and all the E6 in it.
    Regards Søren
     
  2. Monophoto

    Monophoto Member

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    Soren -

    I used to do my own 35mm E-6 processing. My experience was that it was more economical than commercial processing if I shot enough film to be able to use a batch of chemicals to exhaustion within the relatively short shelf-life of the chemicals. It was also a simple (albeit boring) process - no more difficult than black & white processing.

    The only serious challenge was the need to maintain a reasonably consistent temperature (around 100 deg F). I used a large plastic bin as a tempering bath and found that this was close enough for my needs.
     
  3. Soeren

    Soeren Member

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    Just noticed I placed this thread in the wrong forum. Moderator please move it.
    Sorry
    Regards Søren
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 17, 2005
  4. Mick Fagan

    Mick Fagan Subscriber

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    Søren, I have the CPE2 and have had it for about 15-16 years, with the lift.

    I bought it new, along with some carefully picked drums and reels. I can and do develop all of my 35mm, 120 when I have one and also 4x5" with ease.

    Some people say you need the expert drums (which will not fit on the CPE2) for 4x5" for the best possible developing, that may be, but, for most people, the CPE2 is perfect.

    I have done all sorts of developing from B&W reversal, B&W neg, E6, C41, RA4, Duratrans, Cibachrome, colour print film, etc, etc,.

    You will not regret, buying one!

    I believe that the cheapest place in the world, for second hand CPE2 machines, is the UK, followed by Germany.

    To put the popularity of the CPE2 machine in perspective, I was in Germany in a small town called Waiblingen, Nth of Stuttgart. There is a small photo shop where I bought cameras from in 1985 and 1986, I got to know the main salesman there quite well. I mentioned to him that he appeared to sell quite a few of these CPE2 machines, his reply, that his shop sold over 200 units the previous year, staggered me.

    In 1987 that salesman came to Australia and he stayed with us, he gave me some reels and odds and ends for the CPE2 as a gift. He then mentioned that they had moved just over 300 of them in the last year.

    I think the reason they sold so many, was because the Germans used more E6 film for the home market than anywhere else in the world.

    In fact the market in Germany was so biased to the CPE2 machine, that Ilford started selling their B&W developing kit for ID11 in 600ml kits, which happens to be the amount required for the most economical 35mm developing in that machine

    Mick.
     
  5. Ole

    Ole Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Moved!

    It was easier than I thought, and the problems with doing 5x7" in paper drums much less than I thought. :D
     
  6. Soeren

    Soeren Member

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    Sounds like its the thing to do. So now Ill just have to look up a CPE2, a 5X7 camera + and a 4X5 reduction back. Ole, 5X7 in paper drums ? No scratches ?
    Regards Søren
     
  7. Ole

    Ole Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    No scratches.

    I scratched on EFKE 100 badly through disconnecting my brain before loading the drum, but the E6 ones were unharmed. 18x24 BW works great too, as does all the sizes I've tried up to 30x40cm.
     
  8. Soeren

    Soeren Member

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    Any one got a CPE2 + lift and a 5X7 for sale, cheap :smile:
     
  9. Gerald Koch

    Gerald Koch Member

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    I used to do my own E-6 processing and it certainly was cheaper than commercial processing because I used the formulas published in the Dignan Newletter. Not all that hard either.
     
  10. Baxter Bradford

    Baxter Bradford Member

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    Soeren

    I have just started doing my own E6 in a Jobo ATL-1000 using the standard 2906N 4x5 reel and have achieved great results, once I had adjusted the colour balance. This is done by altering pH for which I bought a digital meter from e**y for about £25 and added Sodium Hyroxide to move Colour developer pH from 12.0 to 12.50. Apparently it differs for individual water supplies.

    I chose the Fotospeed 3 bath chemicals and these have produced results comparable with the pro-lab at a fraction of the cost. The standard dev time of 6:30 is spot on when I rate Velvia at ISO40. Cost is about £0.55 per sheet including sleeve, instead of £2.35.

    I chose the ATL Jobo since it is automatic and I want an easy life!
     
  11. Changeling1

    Changeling1 Member

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    Jobo Rotary Processors

    Here are just 3 quick links from the auction site. The CPE-2 processors are less expensive than the CPP-2 or CPA processors but the CPP-2 and CPA processors will accept the Expert Drums which many people consider "the best way" to process sheet film. I would recommend going to the Jobo site
    http://www.jobo-usa.com/index1.html and look carefully at the various systems before investing in a set-up that might not serve your needs in the future.

    http://cgi.ebay.com/Jobo-CPE2-Plus-...564006203QQcategoryZ29993QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

    http://cgi.ebay.com/JOBO-CPE2-ROTAR...563125946QQcategoryZ29993QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

    http://cgi.ebay.com/Jobo-CPE-2-with-Lift_W0QQitemZ7564053711QQcategoryZ29993QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
     
  12. nworth

    nworth Subscriber

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    E-6 processing is easy enough, but it is tedious. Really tight temperature control is only needed in the first developer. The other steps go to completion and are a bit more relaxed. Cost is not too bad, but the prices for kits recently almost doubled. The Tetnal 3 bath kit is now about US$77 for the 5 liter size. The Kodak 6 bath kit is still about US$45 for that size, but shipping can be a problem. I get about three small tanks of film processed per liter in my Jobo. That works out to $1.50 per 120 roll with the Kodak kit if I aways process a full tank.
     
  13. Land Scape

    Land Scape Member

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    Søren,
    I have just started to develop my own E-6 with a roller and Jobo Expert drum that I will preheat to 38 C degrees. The film is outdated 8x10 Ektachrome and I believe my temperature control is not (yet) optimal as I only have a roller, but not the Jobo machine. After all, I am pretty happy with the first results that look more vivid on the light table than scanned http://personal.inet.fi/koti/cambo/index.html
     
  14. fschifano

    fschifano Member

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    It's easy enough to do with plain old SS tanks and reels. No need for an automated processor unless you really want one. Echo the comments about economy and chemical life already mentioned.
     
  15. Soeren

    Soeren Member

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    Thanks for your replies, and Changeling1 thanks for the links.
    So Its not really necessary to use a Processor but temp has to be correct in first bath.
    should aggitation be continious or intermittent ?
    How about devtimes ?
    I read in some of the old threads that some made their own tempering bath using aqarium heaters in coolers :rolleyes: :confused:
    So the color changes with the pH ? Is that so in all chemistry ?
    Regards Søren
     
  16. Soeren

    Soeren Member

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    Just followed the Jobo link and found answers to the temp, devtime and agitation questions. Thanks.
    Regards Søren
     
  17. Baxter Bradford

    Baxter Bradford Member

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    The pH thing is in the Jobo E6 handbook pdf which you can download. You have to buy the chemical seperately, in most cases Sodium Hydroxide to remove red/magenta cast from my Fuji film. It also gives changes for Kodak films.

    I made this into a 20% solution and have to add about 1 to 2 ml to get the change I need for each run. It will almost certainly differ for your water supply. I have found a syringe with a needle gives accurate squirting! My pH meter correct automatically for temp, but is far from the best available - by PHMETER model PH_009(III). A very original naming scheme. Hanna also seem to make very nice ones.

    It is possible to do proper process control strips and measure these with a colour densitometer, but I did mine my eye, comparing with previously processed sheets from a pro-lab from the same shoot.

    As I have only recently started, I am far from expert and will happily listen and learn from those with more experience and knowledge. I did find myself doing a lot of researching to try to get things right as quickly as possible.
     
  18. Bruce Appel

    Bruce Appel Member

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    I just did my first e-6. For me the worst part was having to proccess so much film at once. I didn't want the mixed chemicals to expire, so I did a bunch all at once, and it seemed like that was all I did for a couple days. I used a combiplan tank for 4X5, and patterson tank for mf. For temp control I started out using an aquarium heater, but it quit working, and I found it was not too hard to maintain temp with just a water bath in an ice chest. I probably won't bother fooling with the heater again.