Exposure problem with either orange filter or film pushing....please assist.

Discussion in 'Exposure Discussion' started by BassTone, Apr 23, 2012.

  1. BassTone

    BassTone Member

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    Hello folks,

    I recently acquired my grandfather's old 80's Canon AE-1 Program. I've been putting it through the paces and so far so good with one exception.

    Quick background: Roll No. 1: Kodak Ektar 100 - came out great. Roll No. 2 out-of-date T-Max 100 in HC-110 B, 8 min/66 deg.F - came out great. Roll 3. Legacy Pro 400 (Fuji Neopan 400) pushed to 1600 and used an orange filter, in HC-110 B, 14.5 min/66 deg.F - UNDER EXPOSED. ***

    ***Keep in mind that I developed a roll of the same film, at the same time from a pinhole camera made from an old Ricolet and that roll came out just fine though a tad over exposed, but not bad. Anyway, I mention this because I figure it rules out any problems with development, plus the edge lettering for both rolls look just fine.

    This would be my first pushing experiment and my first use of a B&W filter with this camera...I know, too many variables, right? :whistling:

    In the problem roll just mentioned, there is very little detail at all throughout the roll. Probably not worth proofing. There is probably one or two gradations of tone in the brightest brights and that's it. The roll from the pinhole Ricolet has lots of tonal range and detail.

    Did I do something wrong in pushing? Is the orange filter throwing off my exposure? Is pushing or pulling film a problem with the Canon AE-1 Program? ...Or is there something else that's wrong? I'm a little at a loss.

    Oh, and I'm a novice at all of this too having just these past ten or so months returned to film developing since college (90's)

    Any help or guidance would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! :smile: -John
     
  2. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

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    Were you metering through the orange filter?

    What sort of lighting conditions were you shooting in? Sunny, open sky lighting, single red bulb in a dark jazz club? :wink:
     
  3. Moopheus

    Moopheus Subscriber

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    Usually with contrast filters an exposure adjustment of 1-2 stops is needed, depending on the filter. On some filters, this filter factor is marked on the rim.
     
  4. BassTone

    BassTone Member

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    Ah, good point, Matt. I was shooting in daylight with a mix of bright light to deep shadow. I shot the same subject matter and conditions and often some of the same shot angles as I did with the converted Ricolet pinhole camera.

    I believe this camera to meter through the lens. I did a quick test before beginning the shoot where I looked through the viewfinder at a scene with a broad spectrum of tone without the filter and then with the filter and noted about two f-stops difference in the metering. As I shot most shots in full "Program" mode, I figured the proper compensations would have been made by the camera's little brain. I have a Nikon N80 which meters through the lens and have used this orange filter with great results in manual, aperture priority and auto.

    No markings of suggested compensation on the filter's outer ring or box. Though I will keep your note in mind when I use this filter on my Yashica Electro 35 which meters outside the lens, Moopheus. Should I have shot this roll in manual mode to further compensate regardless of the meter's reading?
     
  5. Newt_on_Swings

    Newt_on_Swings Member

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    You should try another roll before you jump to conclusions whenever pushing film. If your next roll comes out underdeveloped, you can adjust with more exposure, or by increasing your development times by about 20%.
     
  6. RalphLambrecht

    RalphLambrecht Subscriber

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    metring through orange or red filtersoften cause underexposure as the in-camera meteris not red sensitive enough to judge the lihting situation properly. having said that ,external meters suffer from the same problem.
     
  7. Ian C

    Ian C Member

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  8. kossi008

    kossi008 Member

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    I don't think it's the filter. I used filters on Canon A's with no problem, and your observation of 2 stops loss sounds about right for an orange filter.

    I'm guessing it's the pushing, which does mean underexposing and overdeveloping, but still it sound like there should be more tones visible in your case.

    Just repeat with less variables.
     
  9. pentaxuser

    pentaxuser Subscriber

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    I agree with kossie008. Under exposure due to an orange filter shouldn't account for anything like the amount of under exposure you describe if the TTL meter is showing two stops for the filter.

    I'd look elsewhere first for a cause of the problem

    pentaxuser
     
  10. BassTone

    BassTone Member

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    Thanks everyone for your input, very much appreciated! I'll simplify and push another roll with the Canon, soon - sans filter - and see what that yields. Also, I'm going to have a look at the links Ian C posted too. Thanks! :smile:
     
  11. RalphLambrecht

    RalphLambrecht Subscriber

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    don't forget:
    expose for the shadows and develop for the highlights. you cannot compensate for the lack of exposure by increasing development, because you cannot develop what isn't exposed.