Forte paper problem

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Richard Wasserman, Jan 29, 2005.

  1. Richard Wasserman

    Richard Wasserman Member

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    I need help. I tried printing today on Forte Polygrade V FB and the paper has a yellow tint to it that only goes away after washing for about 5 minutes. It prints well and looks fine after washing, but is a distinct ivory color when removed from the fix. I was thinking that perhaps it was not clearing properly in the fix, so I tried both TF-4 and Ilford rapid fix, both mixed fresh today. I had the same problem with both fixers. I also tried 2 boxes of paper from 2 different elmulsion batches purchased about a month ago from Calumet and a box that I've had for a while and had the same thing happen on all of them. I have used this paper extensively in the past and never had any trouble. Anyone have any ideas?
     
  2. dancqu

    dancqu Member

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    How does it look coming out of the developer? Dan
     
  3. Tom Stanworth

    Tom Stanworth Member

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    Sounds weird if it has not happened with the older batches a while back, however, I have some papers which look a tad jaundiced after the fix but whiten up very quickly in the wash. Most FB papers looks yellowish or grey prior to processing and come out whiter, but what you are describing sounds quite a bit yellower than this. For example my oriental seagul definitely is yellower after the fix prior to washing, but it is not ivory, but more of a very pale off white and not immediately obvious. It will even whiten up with a rinse in water prior to holding in a water tray ie without a proper wash.

    I guess if it whitens up it cant be too much to worry about..? maybe......I hope!

    I know Les has mentioned problems with Forte consistency and I experienced it for the first time recently with pack of paper a whole grade softer and 2/3 stop slower than the other batches!

    Tom
     
  4. Richard Wasserman

    Richard Wasserman Member

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    Dan,
    It looks fine in the developer. it's only after I turn the lights on that I can see a problem. The more I think about it the more I think it's a fixer problem, but I'm open to all suggestions.
     
  5. Tom Stanworth

    Tom Stanworth Member

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    Are the lights you are using the same? Is it possible that you have only just noticed something that was always there?...I've done this one before!
     
  6. glbeas

    glbeas Member

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    Is it possible they have incorporated an antihalation dye into the emulsion that is a bit slow to wash out? Seems that would be good to hold fine detail contrast.
     
  7. Tom Stanworth

    Tom Stanworth Member

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    I had no idea that this was done with papers. Interesting thought......is it common in papers?
     
  8. Richard Wasserman

    Richard Wasserman Member

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    I have not changed anything in my darkroom recently. I don't know anything about antihalation dyes in paper-do they do that? The problem I'm having is that the color is so deep that I can't judge the prints until they've washed for a few minutes and this takes too long and is too frustrating. I'm also worried about them not being fixed properly. I have some sodium thiosulfate and will try a simple hypo bath tomorrow to see if that works. I have a nagging suspicion that it's the fix and not the paper-at least I hope so as I have several boxes of the stuff and I really want to use it.
     
  9. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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    How old are the chemicals in the trays that you are using?
     
  10. djklmnop

    djklmnop Member

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  11. KenM

    KenM Member

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    Yup, this is standard with Forte paper....it's nothing to worry about. It can be a bit disconcerting the first time you compare a print that's been in the wash for a few minutes against one that's just come out of the fix, but you get used to it.
     
  12. McCarthy

    McCarthy Member

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    I use Forte now and used Ilford paper in the past. I don't remember Ilford paper being yellow after the fix, but the Forte paper is definitely yellow until washed. It does not bother me at all and I don't consider it a problem. It has never stopped me from judging the quality of the print after the fix step.

    P.S. The next paper I plan to try is the J and C Classic at 320 g/m2. Sounds heavy!
     
  13. Andrew O'Neill

    Andrew O'Neill Subscriber

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  14. Andrew O'Neill

    Andrew O'Neill Subscriber

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    ...maybe I should have said a bit more. If you leave the print in a tray of water after fixing for a few minutes, the yellow will clear.
     
  15. Maine-iac

    Maine-iac Member

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    I've noticed the same thing with the Forte paper I've used. I don't see the yellow-ish tinge on the image itself, but on the borders. However, it's not there following washing and dry-down, so I've concluded it's something to do with the chemistry of the brighteners or whatever that they put in the paper base itself. The dry prints look white, but the ones in the fixer are definitely yell0w-bordered.

    Larry
     
  16. Richard Wasserman

    Richard Wasserman Member

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    I appreciate everyone's responses. It seems as if the yellow color I am seeing is normal, but I find it strange because I have used probably 500 sheets of Forte before this without a problem. The color really is fairly deep and I'm afraid that it will influence how I judge the prints. Washing the prints for even a few minutes before looking at them will slow down the printing process too much. I am about to start on a project where I will be making 5 copies each of about 100 different images and hope to have this trouble behind me when I start. Did Forte perhaps make a change to their paper recently?