Frame Counter

Discussion in 'Camera Building, Repairs & Modification' started by Paul VanAudenhove, Jun 26, 2010.

  1. Paul VanAudenhove

    Paul VanAudenhove Member

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    I just received a Canon F1n, and the first roll I put through it, the frame counter only went to 20 on a 36 exp roll. Just loaded a second film, now the counter isn't working at all. Does anyone know if it's a big deal to get at? Or should I send it in for a service? If the latter, any reccomendations for getting it serviced in Canada?

    Thanks
     
  2. Silence

    Silence Member

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    I have a Canon F-1 from 1971 that has the exact same problem... The counter doesn't even move or, if it does, only counts to 10 or so... I got used to it and now just try to memorize how many pictures I have left.

    If you do get it serviced, please share the results, 'cause I've been curious if it's as simple as changing a spring or something more complex.
     
  3. John Koehrer

    John Koehrer Subscriber

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    Most likely is a pawl that engages the counter, not holding it(the counter)in position.
    The pivot on the pawl may need lubrication or it engagement tooth may be worn. Most likely lube. If it's worn, either replacement, or
    sharpening of the tip is needed.
     
  4. Andrew K

    Andrew K Subscriber

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    It is not the easiest thing to get to - to dismantle it you need to remove the wind lever (we had a special tool at Canon for removing the covering plate - they are usually very tight) - then remove the wind lever.

    Then remove the shutter button (don't loose the ball bearing under the shutter button or the spring under it!)

    then remove the cap from the middle of the shutter dian - unscrew the retaining nut (another special tool - although a pair of pliers sharpened to a flat point will do)-then remove the dial - (remember how it comes aprat, and look out for the big spring..)

    Remove the screws, and the top cover will come off.

    But before doing all this have a look at the plastic window over the frame counter- has it been dislodged? On most of the cameras I worked on at Canon when they were still new frame counter faults were caused either by a loose cover, or a dent in the top cover....rarely does the counter pawl play up...maybe on a ex-press one that has seen more than its fair share of rain (one of mine did rust up a bit - but I did have to leave that body in front of a heater for a few hours to dry the camera out...even the mirror buffer was saturated.....

    Sorry - don't know anyone to repair the camera in Canada...can help in Australia though..

    Cheers

    Andrew
     
  5. Paul VanAudenhove

    Paul VanAudenhove Member

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    Andrew,
    You have have discovered what is messing up my frame counter - mine doesn't have a plastic window over it. Maybe it has fallen inside?
    Paul
     
  6. kraker

    kraker Subscriber

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    I'll keep an eye on this thread. Received a Canon FTb recently, fine camera, in good state after resealing. Except for the counter, which could only count to four during the first roll (haven't tried a second roll yet). Sounds like the same or a similar problem.
     
  7. benjiboy

    benjiboy Subscriber

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    What would be a ten minute job for a service technician could be a disaster if you attempt it, my best advice send it for a CLA because it's probably never had one in thirty years, and the light seals and mirror bumper will need replacing too if you want a reliable picture taking machine, the F1 is a very fine quality professional camera and is worth it.
     
  8. John Koehrer

    John Koehrer Subscriber

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    Andrew,
    I've forgotten about those silly counter windows getting pushed in.
    and I've seen a few of them when I was working.
    Paul, just be aware of where things go & there should be no problem. The window is probably up there somewhere.
     
  9. Andrew K

    Andrew K Subscriber

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    Hi Guys

    the F1 series are not the easiest camera to repair or to dismantle - I would take it to a good camera technician. It's not a big repair - will take 1/2 hour to 40 minutes to do...

    If you really want to try yourself first see if you can find a NF1 service or parts manual first (I'm pretty sure I came across one on the net a while ago) - the pictures will really help you pulling the camera apart.

    As for the FTb - it's been a while, but I suspect the counter mechanism will need to be removed, examined for wear, cleaned and very lightly re-lubricated...It is possible that a tooth is worn off the counter dial if it is always stopping at the same point. Or the actual lever that pushes the frame counter dial may need adjusting...

    FTb's are pretty straight forward to pull apart - and you should be able to download a service manual or parts breakdown from the net to guide you if you feel like giving it a go

    Cheers

    Andrew