Help!

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by cellison, Jan 11, 2008.

  1. cellison

    cellison Member

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    Does anyone have any ideas what would cause the problem at the top of this image?

    Details:

    M3 / 50mm Rigid Summicron
    APX100 / Rodinal 1:50

    [​IMG]
     
  2. radiantdarkroom

    radiantdarkroom Member

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    Could be your developing reel. What kind of developing methods do you use?
     
  3. cellison

    cellison Member

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    I'm using a Paterson plastic reel thingy. Bought it used and I'm wondering if the plastic has soaked up to much chemicals over the years? Does that sound feasible?
     
  4. Aurelien

    Aurelien Advertiser Advertiser

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    Usually this type of mark is found on the 120 film, not on the 135. Do you well wash your reels after processing? If you use wetting agent as a final bath, it's very important, or you will have marks like these.
     
  5. cellison

    cellison Member

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    Now that I think about it the edge with the problem would not be touching the reel :\
     
  6. George Collier

    George Collier Member

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    35mm, right?

    These dark areas are from less development, in the area just next to the clear unexposed margin between frames. Doesn't make sense to me that it could be surge or agitation patterns.
    Maybe could have been a dark thing in front of the camera when shooting, maybe in motion, but it doesn't look like that to me.

    I can't think of anything else, unless some kind of physical disturbance to the film before developing. ??
     
  7. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    cellison

    it looks like problems with your reel/s.
    if you can soak the reels and tank in burning hot water
    and then take a brush and clean everything ...
    maybe it will help with your troubles.

    if it doesn't take care of it, at least you
    can be certain your reels are clean
    and you can "rule them out" ...

    john

    ps. are these marks on the entire roll ? or just this frame ?
     
  8. dpurdy

    dpurdy Subscriber

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    those marks are running the wrong way for reel marks. they are across the film. I am pretty clueless what could cause that. Looks like a developer problem but I don't see how running across the top of a frame like that. I would run a test and see if it was a once only problem.
     
  9. Roger Pellegrini

    Roger Pellegrini Subscriber

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    Looks like a dirty reel and hard water problem.
     
  10. David A. Goldfarb

    David A. Goldfarb Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Presuming the image is shown full frame, it's not a reel problem, because it's not the edge of the frame that is in contact with the reel.

    Is it on every frame? If it is, it could be a shutter issue (but only if you get this all the time with other rolls of film). Could it just have been something in the scene, like a wire, that you didn't see in the viewfinder?
     
  11. resummerfield

    resummerfield Subscriber

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    That's what I'm thinking.

    Are the marks one every frame? Look carefully, as it will be difficult to see on darker images. If so, it would eliminate a reel problem, and point to a problem with the camera. Do you have 2 similar cameras, to shoot 2 rolls of film and then do identical processing?
     
  12. Travis Nunn

    Travis Nunn Member

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    I had the exact same problem about a year or two ago. Switching from plastic to SS reels solved it for me.
     
  13. cellison

    cellison Member

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    After more scanning I noticed this... it looks like the same marks on other negatives. These are frames #2 and #25 from the same roll.

    [​IMG]

    These are the first rolls I've developed shot with this M3... perhaps a problem with the shutter?
     
  14. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    Has to something to do with the shutter/film gate as the problem is the same, there's nothing else that can cause that happening

    Ian
     
  15. vet173

    vet173 Member

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    I had something similar and it turned out to be the foam sealing strip on my f-2 . Don't know how it would apply to the lecia though. Look for a camera light leak. As stated, it doesn't match up for a reel problem.
     
  16. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

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    These would be light areas on the negatives. I don't know how light leak problems could cause this, unless we are talking about there being a general level of fog, except where the marks are.

    Are the marks visible to the naked eye?

    I ask because this could be a problem with the scanning.

    Matt
     
  17. MMfoto

    MMfoto Member

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    Were the smudges near the line present immediately, or are they from handling? Also, can you see this line and smudges using a loupe on the negative directly?
     
  18. MMfoto

    MMfoto Member

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    Open up you Leica and trigger the shutter on bulb and see if there if anything looks odd on the end of the curtain, or in the film gate.

    I've had mystery marks on the other edges that were from little bits of ribbon hanging off the shutter strings during exposure.
     
  19. CPorter

    CPorter Member

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    Is is possible that the film was crimped during loading onto the real? IDK.
     
  20. highpeak

    highpeak Member

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    I have a similar problem before, there is always a hair line in my pictures, then I found out there is really a hair hanging at the film gate!

    As others said, it also could be shutter problem.

    Alex W.
     
  21. cellison

    cellison Member

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    Update

    After inspecting the negatives by eye I realized that I couldn't see anything that would account for the marks. The previous scans I posted here were done with a Nikon Coolsan V. I also have an Epson V700 and decided to try scanning them again and what do you know...

    [​IMG]

    The marks are not there and I think the dark area at the top of the right side images is from the lousy film holder not holding the film flat. That image is at the end of a strip so I think it's curving in slightly.
     
  22. MMfoto

    MMfoto Member

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    sweet