Homemade Glycin

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by schlger, Oct 29, 2007.

  1. schlger

    schlger Member

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    Is there a possibility to make photo Glycin oneself, maybe from para aminophenol?

    Wich literature could I consult if I would like to try my own sythesis?

    Thanks!
     
  2. Sparky

    Sparky Member

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    can't be too much harder than having a home meth lab, can it...? More legal, I hope??
     
  3. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    Yes it is straightforward to do.

    The method is probably in the series "Organic Synthesis" by Arnold Weissberger of Eastman Kodak. It is a multivolume series that describes how to make most common organic chemicals.

    The Merck Index will give you references to making it as well.

    Do NOT confuse glycin with glycine. (gly sin vs gly seen) The first is the developer you want and the second is an essential amino acid.

    PE
     
  4. Uhner

    Uhner Member

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    Quote: Do NOT confuse glycin with glycine. (gly sin vs gly seen) The first is the developer you want and the second is an essential amino acid.

    Thanks. I was planning to make some FX-2 for the first time; and here in Scandinavia the essential amino acid is called Glycin… You definitely saved me both some film and some trouble. Seems like I have to stick to FX-1 for the time being.
     
  5. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

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    I've never made glycin myself, but I briefly looked into it a couple of years back. I was told by a reliable source (a frequent contributor here and I shouldn't drag them into it, but if they wish to involve themselves, ok) that it is dangerous and that should not attempt it. That's all the info I could get.

    PE, can you go into more details or shed any light on the danger part?
     
  6. AgX

    AgX Member

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    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 29, 2007
  7. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    Jim;

    Making glycin is not hard, nor particularly dangerous AFAIK. It is a straightforward addition of several chemicals and a purification. The chemicals themselves, as always, are dangerous and you have to be careful not to get things too hot or cold. Just like cooking, but with somewhat dangerous and toxic chemicals instead of dangerous and toxic food like chicken with salmonella. :D

    PE
     
  8. AgX

    AgX Member

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    You shouldn't have written this, PE.
    Now there is a chance that chicken will end on some banning-list too...
     
  9. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

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    PE, Thanks. Yes, all chems are dangerous to some degree. Perhaps my source was just being careful.
     
  10. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

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    BTW, chicken is what's on the menu tonight!
     
  11. Photo Engineer

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    I hope it is well done!

    PE
     
  12. Neanderman

    Neanderman Member

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    The 8th Ed lists three references. I suspect the easiest to find/decipher is:

    Meldola, Foster, Brightman, J. Chem. Soc. 111, 552 (1917)

    It's prepared from p-aminophenol and chloracetic acid.

    I'm not a chemist, use at your own risk, yada yada.

    Ed
     
  13. JPD

    JPD Member

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  14. skahde

    skahde Member

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    I appreciate that Omikron added photo-glycin to their catalogue (along with dimezone S some time ago btw). But judged by the price the Photoformulary is asking - and ordering from them is easy when you are in europe - I have to agree that Omikron's pricing is a bit off. OTOH the stuff is probably relabeled from the same source. AFAIK and after taking a deeper look into that issue some years ago there seems to be only one maker left: The Photoformulary.

    best

    Stefan
     
  15. schlger

    schlger Member

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    Do you have acess to the article? The Royal Society of Chemistry sells it as download PDF for 22 Pounds.
     
  16. AgX

    AgX Member

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    "42.80 Euro for only 10g?!"

    Yes, I stumbled over that price too…
    I was negligent in not to cross-check that with other possible suppliers. I'm sorry for that.

    Furthermore, all that stories here about having difficulties of obtaining chemicals in the USA was the reason for me to think the OP thought of trying to do a synthesis himself; obviously this is not the reason.
     
  17. Photo Engineer

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    This article is probably in the library of a nearby college with a chemistry department. It is probably also reprinted in the Weissberger book.

    Any library with chemistry journals probably carries it.

    PE
     
  18. Neanderman

    Neanderman Member

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    PE is probably right. That would definitely be the case here in the states.

    If you can't find it, the answer would be, yes, I could likely get a copy fairly easily. And I would probably not be violating copyright to copy it. :tongue:

    Ed
     
  19. Kirk Keyes

    Kirk Keyes Member

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    Chloroacetic acid is rather corrosive compared to most commonly used acids. And it smells bad. Well, that's probably an understatement. It is extremely destructive to tissues of the mucous membranes and upper respiratory tract.

    Anyway, I'd suggest that if you've passed a college level organic chemistry lab class you probably have the skills to do this - if you have the proper ventilation system available. Otherwise, your roommates will hate you and the neighbors call the cops thinking you and making meth or something.

    But for the average photographic chemistry buff, you should just bite the bullet and just buy some...
     
  20. Photo Engineer

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    Chloroacetic acid is used by dermatologists to cauterize the skin when growths are removed. It is certainly not good to get on your body or to inhale the vapors. It will burn you. OTOH, it can be placed on a swab and applied to an open wound. It is not like phenol, lye or sulfuric acid which would just keep on eating away at you and which can cause severe chemical burns.

    The synthesis of glycin is very very simple and straightforward. In some ways, it is no more difficult to make than some of the photographic solutions we have seen mixed here.

    If you use chloroacetic acid, no dust mask will protect your lungs. You must use a hood with good suction and the ventiated gas must not be discharged in such a way as to hurt anyone. Either that or you must work outdoors. In any case, you must make the glycin in small quantities if you insist on doing it.

    Personally, I think that this is a very dangerous idea even if it is rather simple to accomplish. Just because it is simple does not mean the idea is worthwhile or practical or safe.

    PE
     
  21. Kirk Keyes

    Kirk Keyes Member

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    I proper hood is important. I worked outside once with hydrofluoric acid - it worked fine until the light breeze I was working in switched directions and I got a nose full of HF vapours. I don't recommend doing that.
     
  22. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    yes, from what i understand, they are the only maker left (at least in the states ) and they make it ever few weeks.

    i always thought glycin was made with chicken fat
    until i realized the "er" in my ways.

    :smile:
     
  23. schlger

    schlger Member

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    I recieved the article over the computer network of the local univerity library. Her is the part, which relates to the synthesis of glycin:

    ... Vater CJ. pr. Chem., 1884 [ii], 29, 286) obtained this compound by digesting one molecular proportion of monochloro acetic acid with two molecular proportions of p-aminophenol and 20 parts of water. we found that a better yield was obtained by using molecular proportions of p-aminophenol (3g), monochloroacetic acid (2,6g), and sodium acetate (4g) in aqueous solution. The pink solid which separated was collected and crystallised from water, from which it separated only on stirring in a somewhat floculent form. (Found, N= 8,42. Calc., N= 8,39 per cent). ...