how to disassembly Rolleiflex 3.5f shutter speed drum and aperture drum

Discussion in 'Camera Building, Repairs & Modification' started by mk23, Feb 1, 2014.

  1. mk23

    mk23 Member

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    does anybody know how to disassembly the shutter speed drum and aperture drum around the sucher lens:smile:
    thanks so much for help
     

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  2. Paul Goutiere

    Paul Goutiere Subscriber

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    If you don't know how to do these things, may I gently advise you not to try. That 3.5f is a marvelous camera.

    I don't know where you are, but I sent my older K4B to Harry Fleenor. http://www.rolleirepairs.com/

    It was not really that expensive and he returned a very useable camera.
     
  3. mk23

    mk23 Member

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    i am living in germany, where rolleiflex is at home. i am interesting to study how the whole metering mechanism works, so i would like to do it myself.
    thanks for the advise
     
  4. BrianShaw

    BrianShaw Member

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    I buy Rollei parts. :wink:
     
  5. baachitraka

    baachitraka Subscriber

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    You can also do ausbildung in any of the reputed Rollei repair centers in Germany. Please, do not do it by yourself unless you know how to.

    I once opened the Isolette III top to clean the rangefinder and realized how miniature and delicate are those screws and parts. I may never do it again.
     
  6. Paul Goutiere

    Paul Goutiere Subscriber

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    Have you done this sort of thing yourself?

    The Rollei 3.5f is a fairly complex camera. I'm not suggesting you aren't up to it, but it can take a fair bit of time
    and effort to do even simple things.

    I think most of us would rather take pictures. The Rolleiflex 3.5f is one lovely camera.

    There are manuals available on line for these things. Try- http://www.kyphoto.com/classics/repairmanuals.html
     
  7. mk23

    mk23 Member

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    i have read the manual. it's nearly useless, because it didn't give any information about the disassembly. there were only sketch in the manual, which were very hard to understand.
     
  8. shutterfinger

    shutterfinger Subscriber

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    I do not remember the term for this type of manual but it is for the experienced technician. It is basically an Illustrated Parts Breakdown. The numbers correspond to the assembly order. You have to look at different sections to find all of the information for each model covered. Compur uses the same type of manual. They're easy to follow once you get the hang of it but getting the hang can be like trying to climb a 90° rock face that is over 100 meters high with only a small rope in your hand that is attached to you only.
     
  9. Paul Goutiere

    Paul Goutiere Subscriber

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    I don't care how clever you are sir, you stand a chance of damaging a rather valuable camera.

    Cost of repair on these isn't prohibitively expensive and since you live in Germany you may have the creme de la creme
    of Rolleiflex technicians close by.

    When you have repaired as many as a thousand cameras in a career, as some of these people may have done, you get rather adept at it.
     
  10. shutterfinger

    shutterfinger Subscriber

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    If I had one and it was dead I would give it a go. Even if I failed and quit it could still be serviced and put into operation by an experienced technician. now, where did i put that hammer?
     
  11. Paul Goutiere

    Paul Goutiere Subscriber

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    Zactly!
     
  12. BrianShaw

    BrianShaw Member

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    Not zactly. Amateur failures can sometimes not be repairable by an experienced tech. Lose parts or damage parts, etc. And if they try it might cost 3x (or more) what it would have cost for that repair in the first place.
     
  13. Dan Daniel

    Dan Daniel Subscriber

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    There is someone on the US Ebay who sells repair manuals that are actually useful. Here is his Rolleiflex listing-
    http://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?_odk...m570.l1313&_nkw=rolleiflex&_sacat=0&_from=R40

    The 'cross-coupled' manual and the Rolleiflex F manual, both for National Camera, would probably be of use. The major issue with the F model is getting the coupling mechanism back in proper alignment.

    The shutter/aperture rings in your photo are not like the older models, so I can't offer any advice on getting them off. I have disassembled the older mechanisms, and one thing you must do is study the alignment of the rings in relation to the dials that cause them to move. The F with its meter coupling will make this an area to study for a long time, and take apart very slowly. The rings will need to be returned in alignment with the meter coupling.

    It's your camera to do with as you will, of course. Personally I figure my first run at any complex camera is going to be more of a dissection and autopsy. If I am not prepared to lose the camera, to end up with a parts camera, then I don't go in. I've overhauled a few Rolleiflexes for people. But I won't touch someone else's F until I have one of my own and do my learning on it.

    Despite everyone's dire words, Rolleiflexes are well-designed, well-thought out mechanisms. Meaning that with some study and attention to various interlocks, they are meant to be taken apart and put back together. If you are experienced with such mechanisms and are patient, you can figure it out. Maybe. If I was doing this, I would probably establish certain base points, then remove single parts, re-install the part and check function, remove that part and the next one, re-assemble and check, remove one, two and three parts... etc. etc.

    Look at this part-
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rolleiflex-...709?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43b5432a75

    It's part of the meter coupling mechanism (the seller doesn't know what it is), and it has to be precisely aligned for assembly. Just to give you an idea of what you are in for...
     
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  15. mk23

    mk23 Member

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    i did many CLA of cameras my self but generally are only small opertation (oiling the gear and shaft or cleaning the aperture and lens). so a little experience i did have.

    thanks a lot, that so many people have gave me advise for not trying DIY. I know rollei is a precise maschine. i am a conservative person and won't do anything disassembling until i understand the principle. every step i do, i will mark the position and take a photo of it. so if anything goes wrong, i can still through the photo or mark restore it. the camera metering system works well, so i don't need any alignment. what i need is only disassembly and re assembly in the same position. the shutter in slow speed under 1/15 is too slow. if i get the both drums off, then i can take the cover of shutter off and reach the hemmwerk (gear set in english?) i will put some watch oil in the hemmwerk.



    thanks to Dan Daniel for recommending books.

    all informations about disassembly are still welcomed.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 2, 2014
  16. benjiboy

    benjiboy Subscriber

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    Many camera service engineers won't touch equipment that has been tampered with by unskilled labour, because they often find components, screws, and springs missing. When I handled the repairs for a group of ten camera stores before I retired the repair companys I used wouldn't accept gear for repair if the owner had attempted to fix it themselves.
     
  17. mk23

    mk23 Member

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    i got finally disassembled, after little study the manual. it was quite easy. the viewing lens must be first unscrewed. by unscrewing you should remember how many round it was turned, so that the focus length not changed at reassembling. then unscrew the brass retainring (yellow) out. the best way to keep alignment is setting the aperture to 22 and speed to 1/500, so that the both drum keep in the end position.

    to reach the shutter you should unscrew a very thiniy screw under photo lens and then remove the black retainring with remember the original position. it determine the degree of tightness of the aperture and speed dials. finally becarefull take the shutter cover and two gearring away and mark the position. after oil the gear set in the shutter. the slow speed under 1/15 run perfect
     
  18. Dan Daniel

    Dan Daniel Subscriber

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    Congratulations.

    Although you are now officially excommunicated from the Church of the Rolleiflex CLA for heresy and apostasy. You chose doing the work yourself when we all know it can only be done by officials of the Holy See in Braunschweig. Hell awaits you, heathen. May your future be rich in Yashica-Mats; they are all you deserve to touch with your evil paws.

    In the meantime, enjoy the camera.

    Suggestion: wait a few days before reassembling everything. Synchro-Compurs can be fickle. I've had them stop working after a couple of days of doing well. I've also had them go for three years after a couple of drops of naphtha and a couple of drops of oil. Go figure. All in all, I've had good results with the slow speed dragging with simple oiling like you have done.
     
  19. BrianShaw

    BrianShaw Member

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    And that's the truth!
     
  20. vysk

    vysk Member

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    Yes, I've done CLA of the 2.8F and 3.5F. It is a mechanism that requires great care to assemble correctly. Too much lubricant or the incorrect type, and the movement is stiff. And if you bend one of the rings, you could be in for a world of frustration.

    And getting the meter and depth of field coupling correct is also tricky. And the malfunctioning part might not be where you think it is. That "bent metal clip" that couples the differential is most mysterious.

    good luck if you got it all right.

    And the simple rules are:
    - make notes of everything, even the most simple. e.g. how many turns it took to unscrew something, where gear teeth mesh, what angle things align at
    - the light shield if the taking lens is exceptionally tricky - take careful observation should you ever take it off

    Good luck

    Vick
     
  21. vysk

    vysk Member

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    um, yeah. The key is "the right quantity of the correct lube.

    Dry is not always correct.

    And oil is not always correct, when it needs grease. And vice versa.

    And, most frustrating, you find out "the next day" when you re-assembled everything and just want to go out and shoot.

     
  22. mk23

    mk23 Member

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    i've done before once oiling a rapid compur. i also have luberication plan for compur shutters in hand. i used the synthetic watch oil möbius 9010 to oil the shaft and bearing. gear should not be oiled. for solvent i used lighter fluid from zippor, which volatilize very quickly.
     
  23. mk23

    mk23 Member

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  24. E. von Hoegh

    E. von Hoegh Member

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    It leaves an oily residue which both contaminates the synthetic Moebius oil and causes it to spread. In other words it makes all the work of cleaning and lubricating the shutter pointless.
     
  25. mk23

    mk23 Member

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    which solvent will you take. i heard something like film cleaner or Naptha but its hard to get in germany
     
  26. HansKerensky

    HansKerensky Member

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    There are indeed lighterfluids which are not that clean themselves and leave a residue.
    My favorite lighterfluid is the one from the german DM Drogerie (Benzin für Feuerzeuge u.Haushalt).

    Hope they still sell it as i didn't see any last time i was around there.:sad: