ID-11 in a small tank

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Edimilson, Sep 11, 2008.

  1. Edimilson

    Edimilson Member

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    Hello!

    I have just bought enough ID-11 to make 5 litres of stock solution. I must be very dumb, because I didn't know that ID-11 is a "powder film developer and replenisher for the high volume black and white film processing in deep tanks and dip & dunk (hanger) processors". In the fact sheet available at Ilford Photo there is no information about using ID-11 in small tanks. The fact sheet I did find says "Information about using ID-11 in dishes/trays, small tanks and rotary tube processors is available in a separate fact sheet" - this I haven't been able to locate.

    So, can you help me? Where can I find this fact sheet?
    Thanks!
     
  2. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    It can be used just as easily for smaller volumes of film. Make up the 5 litres, download the data-sheet from here.

    You need to decide whether you use it Full Strength, 1+1 1+3 etc, in fact you can use it 1+2 as well. The data sheet is quite different to the one I have in the UK from the 70's but the developer hasn't changed.

    I would use FS and return the used dev to the 5 litre container, re-using and increasing the dev times as recommended. Check out Kodak D76 data-sheets as the devs are interchangeable.

    Ian
     
  3. pentaxuser

    pentaxuser Subscriber

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    You simply make up a stock solution of 5 litres then use as stock or dilute 1+1 with water as required. Full instructions on the Ilford Harman site in terms of agitation, times temperatures etc. Ilford Photo site is I think the Swiss company making Ilfochrome colour materials so no wonder there was nothing there.

    Google Ilford Harman and keep as a favourite or bookmark site. I find myself referring to it frequently.

    pentaxuser
     
  4. Bob F.

    Bob F. Member

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    You know, I never noticed that before! As I use Ilford films, I tend to use the film data sheets for processing instructions which do include instructions for small tanks etc.

    The other processing data sheets they mention are at http://www.ilfordphoto.com/applications/page.asp?n=47&t=Developing+Black+and+white+film - use the "Unreplenished Systems" pages.

    Good luck, Bob.

    [Addendum: Agitation info is also in the "Film Processing Chart pdf" here: http://www.ilfordphoto.com/applications/page.asp?n=87&t=Developing+Black+and+white+film ]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 11, 2008
  5. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    Over the years I've known many people use the 5 litre packs of ID-11 & Microphen for small tanks, and I used to use a 5 litre bottle of Microphen myself while at school - I'd guess 69-70. Ilford used to publish a far better data sheet, the current one isn't really appropriate.

    Ian
     
  6. Anscojohn

    Anscojohn Subscriber

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    [
    You need to decide whether you use it Full Strength, 1+1 1+3 etc, in fact you can use it 1+2 as well.


    *******

    IIRC, Gene Smith used it 2:1 for the Minimata negs. I think this kind of replicated Ansco 47.
     
  7. oldlugs

    oldlugs Member

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    ID-11 is an all-around, do it all (adequately) developer. The 5 litre package was for making a large quantity of the stuff, in case you need to fill deep tanks. Formula should be identical to the 1 litre packaging, and for all intents, the same as D-76. I've got a 5 litre box of ID-11 here as well, but it stays in the box 'cause I know I won't use it up before it's oxidized. (and I mix my own from bulk chemicals, in 1 litre amounts) For smaller tank use, I'd suggest that after you find a convenient way to mix and store it, you just go by published times for either ID-11 or D-76 (they'll be the same).
     
  8. Edimilson

    Edimilson Member

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    Thank you very much, all of you.
     
  9. pentaxuser

    pentaxuser Subscriber

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    I have no idea if 3 or 5 litre wine boxes exist in Brazil but in the U.K. I would pour the 5 litres into two 3 litre wine boxes. Each box has an inner silver lightproof bag and a tap which can be levered out. Wash out the bag and then fill with stock solution until full, ensuring that the liquid comes to the neck of the bag, re-fit the tap and place back into the box. As the stock is poured out the bag collapses. No air can enter.

    It's one of the best methods of storing liquids that I know. Concertina bottles is another way where you press the bottle down and force the liquid to the neck of the bottle. There is a chance that the plastic can allow air to slowly pass into the bottle. Better than plastic bottles are brown glass bottles. Again pour the liquid in until it is completely full and then drop round glass marbles or plastic balls into the bottle each time you use some of the liquid to bring the remaining liquid back to the top.

    If you use the wine box method make sure you drink the wine first!

    Best of luck

    pentaxuser
     
  10. srs5694

    srs5694 Member

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    For hobbyist or small-volume users, and especially for somebody who's just starting out, I disagree with this recommendations. It'll be simpler and easier to learn to dilute it 1+1 or greater and use it one-shot -- that is, throw away the used developer. That way you don't need to worry about increasing development times after each re-use, which simplifies the process and makes for greater consistency for learning purposes.

    OTOH, different developer dilutions produce slightly different results, and it's conceivable that you (that is, Edimilson) will prefer the results undiluted. There's no way of knowing this starting out, though, so IMHO it's better to stick with the simpler procedure for the sake of simplicity when learning. You can experiment with different dilutions later, and if you like full-strength results, change your procedure at that time.
     
  11. Stuggi

    Stuggi Member

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    A nifty way for storing ID-11 (and any other developer or chemical for that matter) is to get 'em brown glass bottles from a pharmacy, they are really cheap (cheaper than ANY bottles meant for storing darkroom chemicals in) and they are ten times better for storing chemicals, the bottle caps are chemical resistant and you can store any numbers of chemicals in them (the pharmacy that sold mine told me that they store HCl and HF in the same bottles, so developer should have the same effect as water on them).
     
  12. tbm

    tbm Member

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    I regularly buy the "5 litres" ID-11 box at Freestyle Camera when I am there. When I get home, I mix the entire plastic pouch's contents, as recommended, with filtered water from the Amway kitchen filter spigot in our kitchen. I then pour it into 500 milliliter amber glass bottles with plastic caps I got from Photographers' Formulary. This way, the ID-ll lasts many months in my darkroom, which is located in my garage in Southern California, regardless of the changes in seasonal temperatures.
     
  13. hywel

    hywel Member

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    use this link, it covers ID-11 (and Ilford's other Powder developers) for small tanks. Don't ask me why Ilford can't name them better and link to the useful one. I've got them downloaded and named ID-11 and Powder developers and still open the wrong one from time to time.

    http://www.ilfordphoto.com/Webfiles/200621612182416.pdf

    Hywel
     
  14. fschifano

    fschifano Member

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    Ilford's ID-11 and Kodak's D-76 are functionally identical. Ilford's product comes in two separate packages and Kodak's has everything in a single envelope. Other than that, they are completely interchangeable. If you don't get the answers you need from Ilford, download Kodak's data sheet for D-76 here: http://www.kodak.com/global/en/professional/support/techPubs/j78/j78.pdf. Ilford's recommended development times differ from Kodak's recommendations for some films, but remember that these are just recommendations and not commandments cast in stone.
     
  15. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    Using ID-11/D76 (or Microphen) Full Strength is remarkably easy. 5 litres will process about 50 films. This is exactly what I used when I was just starting out. Later I started using replenishment. I would split the mixed developer into two 2.5 litre containers for more practical use, this is how I currently work with the 5 litre packs of Xtol.

    Ian