Ilfochrome Corrosion Show and Tell

Discussion in 'Color: Film, Paper, and Chemistry' started by Stephen Frizza, Jul 2, 2010.

  1. Stephen Frizza

    Stephen Frizza Member

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    Regular maintenance of Ilfochrome processors is a must, there are many components that need regular checking especially in the Bleach bath. I have attached a sample of why regular maintenance is a MUST. in the picture attached I show a normal Bolt for a bleach rack on the left before it has been installed into a processor. The 2 screws on the right are from 6 months exposure to ilfochrome bleach. note how the bleach has dissolved the screws. If such corrosion isn't seen to this can cause huge problems to the machine. parts need constant replacement. I think this is a good example as to how strong the chemistry in this process is.
     

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  2. lxdude

    lxdude Member

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    The picture looks like plated steel. If it is, try stainless steel.
     
  3. Stephen Frizza

    Stephen Frizza Member

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    I should have made mention the bolts supplied by the makers are special titanium alloy designed for those machines. The normal stainless steel bolts are lucky to last a week in the bleach. titanium alloy lasts about 6 months.
     
  4. lxdude

    lxdude Member

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    Ouch! I thought of mentioning titanium but it's expensive and hard to find.
    Polymer maybe? Or not strong enough?
     
  5. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    Guys;

    This is the inherent problem with Ilfochrome! It is highly corrosive and toxic and difficult to ship.

    Love it or leave it!

    PE
     
  6. Stephen Frizza

    Stephen Frizza Member

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    well I LOVE it YAY for ilfochrome! and thank god for hundreds of spare parts :smile:
     
  7. lxdude

    lxdude Member

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    ^^:D^^
     
  8. andrewkirkby

    andrewkirkby Member

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    I saw this at Stephen's lab last night. The business end of the bolt looks like swiss cheese!

    Corrosive or not, the benefits outweigh the the problems - IMHO :smile:
     
  9. Poisson Du Jour

    Poisson Du Jour Member

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    It's a lot bloody better than digital "we can produce better prints than Cibas!" crap.
     
  10. Stephen Frizza

    Stephen Frizza Member

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    Agreed!
     
  11. AgX

    AgX Member

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    There are stainless steels that can withstand sulphuric acid.
    Though with the actual bleach solution things may change.


    Stephen, depending on the severity of this issue you might try to get samples of higher resistance steels and if it works get those parts off stock or having them machined.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 3, 2010
  12. Stephen Frizza

    Stephen Frizza Member

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    the corrosion issue isn't a problem I just take it as part of the process, one thing i am about to start is that at the end of each day removing the bleach racks and letting them soak in water overnight to slow the corrosion down, but as i mentioned I have hundreds of spares for exactly this issue. thanks for the heads up on certain stainless steels that can withstand sulphuric acid I didnt know this.
     
  13. Bob Carnie

    Bob Carnie Subscriber

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    I had a ciba chrome Px3 unit for 15years and never saw that kind of erosion in the bleach rack.

     
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  15. Stephen Frizza

    Stephen Frizza Member

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    what was the make of the machine bob? was it one of the Colenta processors?
     
  16. Bob Carnie

    Bob Carnie Subscriber

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    Yes , There were a run of Colenta Ciba machines made back in the early mid 90's I bought a 32 inch.
    These machines were made Ciba Specific and had a lot of overkill, that you do not see on regular processors converted to ciba.

     
  17. Stephen Frizza

    Stephen Frizza Member

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    Ah the machine I have is the 50inch actually our machine was the prototype. the first ever of its kind. It wasnt meant for sale but it works a charm.....
     
  18. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    Stephen, what material is the bolt screwing into, where, and what function ? I have quite a bit of experience of working with highly corrosive boiling acids (I built gold refineries).

    Ian
     
  19. Stephen Frizza

    Stephen Frizza Member

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    The bolt photographed goes into the rack supports for the bleach. the rack supports are made of plastic. and the corrosion is not a problem with regular maintenance. I simply posted the image of these screws as an example of the strength of the bleach on machine parts over long periods of time.
     
  20. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    OK, get some bolts made from Polypropylene or PTFE, or whatever the racks are made from. They can be made very easily, and they won't cost much at all.

    I used to buy filter housings from the US, the types used in some photo-labs, the steel nuts & bolts used would corrode badly, in the end I had my own filter housings made and that was the end of the problems, and the cost dropped substantially.

    Ian
     
  21. Mick Fagan

    Mick Fagan Subscriber

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    Gold Refineries???????

    I've never had a woman that was that expensive!:D

    Mick.
     
  22. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    Long story, but the chemistry is related :D

    We dealt with recycling precious metals from the jewellery trade, photography scrap film, fixers, bleach fixes etc, even cyanide plating/strpping solutions.

    Ian
     
  23. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    The continued dissolution of metal into the bleach will have some effect even if it is only the buildup of sludge. I would keep a close lookout for particulate matter and decreasing bleach activity with buildup of stain in white areas. Just be on the safe side.

    PE
     
  24. Mainecoonmaniac

    Mainecoonmaniac Subscriber

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    What's the chemicals doing to your plumbing? Yikes!
     
  25. John R.

    John R. Member

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    I would find plastic substitutes as well. It almost seems like maybe there is a dissimilar metal electrolysis going on as well as a simple chemical action. If you pull the racks frequently and rinse them down do you have the same problem? Maybe part of the issue is a low grade stainles alloy.
     
  26. domaz

    domaz Member

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    Ilfochrome bleach cannot be flushed down the drain- it has to be neutralized and thrown away.