Ilford Art 300 and non Ilford chemicals

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by mistercody, Dec 3, 2011.

  1. mistercody

    mistercody Member

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    Hi All,

    I just started printing with the new Ilford Multigrade Art 300. I am loving this paper so much. It feels so luxurious and I love the slight warm tone.

    Anyway, I notice that the fixing times listed on the fact sheet are much shorter than what I normally do. The times listed, though, mention Ilford fixers. I am using Kodak rapid fixer, and I am wondering what times I should use, and what the maximum fixing time would be. I normally fix for 5-10 minutes using Kodak rapid fixer. Are the times of 1-2 minutes using Ilford fixer really correct for archival purposes? It seems so short.

    I have noticed that at 30 minutes in the wash, the paper seems more delicate, so I am sticking with the recommended 30 minute wash time versus the usual hour I do.

    Thanks for any help. I want to make sure I am processing this paper archivally and do not overdo anything that could degrade image or paper.

    Cody
     
  2. bdial

    bdial Subscriber

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    You don't need more than 1 or 2 minutes with Kodak Rapid fix either, 5 - 10 is way too long.

    You're possibly ok if you use the recommended time for a rapid fix (no matter what brand) and Ilford's recommended wash time, but your water is different than Ilford's.
    The only way to really know is to do a retained fixer test.
     
  3. pentaxuser

    pentaxuser Subscriber

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    More than the recommended time is likely to give problems of eliminating fixer in the wash process. When longer isn't better that's one thing but when longer is worse then it's to be avoided at all costs. Certainly wastes time and probably water as well

    pentaxuser
     
  4. Simon R Galley

    Simon R Galley Subscriber

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    Dear Mistercody,

    Pleased you like ART 300:

    Bdial is spot on...1 to 2 minutes, any Rapid Fix in a reputable brand.

    Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :
     
  5. Thomas Bertilsson

    Thomas Bertilsson Subscriber

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    I think it was Ralph Lambrecht that mentioned that it's almost impossible to wash all of the fixer out of a print that's been fixed for longer than two minutes.

    My own method is two bath, Ilford Hypam at film strength. First bath is from previous printing session, for one minute. Second bath is fresh. 45s in each and then into a quick rinsing bath, and then directly into a tray with a siphon, or an archival washer. 90 seconds total.
    Used to be 60s in each bath, but at film strength a fiber print is adequately fixed in 60 seconds. 90 seconds sounded like a good compromise.
     
  6. Colin Corneau

    Colin Corneau Subscriber

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    Wow, glad I saw this thread...I've been fixing my Art300 for 5-7 minutes!

    Granted, I use Hypo Clearing and a good hour in an archival washer, but still.
     
  7. Roger Cole

    Roger Cole Member

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    It depends on how the rapid fix is mixed. The instructions with Kodak Rapid Fixes give different dilutions fir film and paper with paper half strength. The Ilford recommendations are for rapid fix mixed to the film strength and the washing recommendations base on no hardener in the fix. With KRF just leave out the part B which is the hardener.
     
  8. Toffle

    Toffle Member

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    Good to know... I have a bad habit of letting my last print of the night sit in the fix whilst I start clearing things up. (It should go straight to the wash like all the rest, but somehow I've developed that habit.)
     
  9. Simon R Galley

    Simon R Galley Subscriber

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    Dear Toffle...you and thousands of others....including me:

    I have got a lot better though : much more disciplined in the darkroom now 2 mins in the fix max FB or RC....it is also a little cheaper on the pocket extending fix life... ( admittedly by a small amount )

    Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited
     
  10. mistercody

    mistercody Member

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    Thanks all for your replies,

    This is good to know. I should save a lot of time now. I will try the shorter times and do a test using selenium toner to see if all is well.

    The reason I fix so long is that I was taught that way. I use the lab at our local university where I took a class, and the sign over the fixer says 5-10 minutes, but I am not sure if they are adding the hardener. I was under the impression they didn't, but I'll ask.

    Thanks again,

    Cody

    P.S. This new 300 Art paper has reignited my love of the darkroom. I already enjoy every minute I am in there, but I am so pleased with this paper that I'm thinking of what shots I have and what new work I'll create to best take advantage of this lovely stuff.
     
  11. bdial

    bdial Subscriber

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    Are you sure the school was using a rapid fix?
    For non-rapid fixers 5 - 10 minutes would be about right.

    Use of the hardner doesn't change the fixing time, but it makes washing more difficult.
     
  12. Roger Cole

    Roger Cole Member

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    I started to post the same thing - bet they were using non-rapid fixer like Kodak Fixer from powder or Kodafix, the liquid equivalent. Those times would be right for those.