Ilford Cool Tone Paper Developer - Thoughts?

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Colin Corneau, Dec 19, 2011.

  1. Colin Corneau

    Colin Corneau Subscriber

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    Recently picked some of this stuff up at quite a steep discount. I've never used it, and if anything prefer warm tone paper and overall look.

    But, hey...cheap is cheap. I'm curious to try it out with some Oriental FB paper I have.

    Does this developer really make that big a difference, in your experience? Or, do you have any favorite uses for it? I have a few images that would specifically suit a cooler tone.
     
  2. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

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    Colin:

    you may not be aware that this developer has been discontinued due to slow sales - much to the disappointment of Simon Galley, who apparently was its original "champion".

    I've never used it, but I do like cool tone papers (Ilford RC cooltone being one of my favourites).
     
  3. Adrian Twiss

    Adrian Twiss Member

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    Yes it does give cool tones. Slightly colder than Tetenal Eukobrom and very similer to Tetenal Documol. Worked well with papers like Kentmere Fineprint FB the late lamented Forte Polygrade.
     
  4. steven_e007

    steven_e007 Member

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    It is a great shame that it was discontinued because there are many options for warm tone developers and it is easy to mix your own or modify existing ones.... There is very little choice in cold tone developers. Tetenal Eukobrom is about the only thing I can get where I live.

    It is said that adding Benzotriazole solution 'cools' the tone of a developer - but I believe that Ilford's 'cooltone' contained some other 'top secret' restrainer which has not been divulged, so we can not 'mix our own' :sad:
     
  5. tomalophicon

    tomalophicon Member

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    Just put in the fridge for half an hour before your darkroom session...
     
  6. Tom Kershaw

    Tom Kershaw Subscriber

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    I performed some fairly extensive tests about 18 months ago when I came into possession of a litre container of the Harman cool tone developer, and agree that Harman was / is using a proprietary restrainer and possibly some other techniques to achieve the dramatic results. No amount of adding BZTS to conventional developers seems to work beyond a possible placebo effect. Perhaps older papers responded differently.

    Tom
     
  7. Mark Layne

    Mark Layne Member

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    If you use this with MGWT or other warmtone paper you will get the closest imitation of a gold toned print that you are likely to come up with. Try a snowscene with MGWT. It also seems to keep forever.
    Mark
     
  8. Colin Corneau

    Colin Corneau Subscriber

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    Interesting stuff...I've pretty much settled on Ilford's Warmtone FB paper and Oriental FB regular papers. Looks like I'll have some experimenting to do.

    I bought 2 1-litre containers, and there was one more at the store that I saw. Wouldn't it just be my luck to fall in love with this stuff...
     
  9. brian steinberger

    brian steinberger Member

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    I really wish Ilford would bring this back. I would be a follower. There really aren't any coldtone developers available, in the US anyway. Arista and Clayton coldtone developers just don't cut it. Simon? Any chance?
     
  10. nworth

    nworth Subscriber

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    I used it for a while. Not quite as cool as Dektol on Multigrade IV.
     
  11. zsas

    zsas Member

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    I second or third. Simon, look at HP Computer, they tried to have a go at tablets and that didn't work out so the made the operating system open source (WebOS), maybe something similar could be done to the cold tone magic formula ("open source") or maybe be sold to someone else? I'm a "cold toner" who is addicted to gold chloride to get my cold blue/blacks.
     
  12. Simon R Galley

    Simon R Galley Subscriber

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    Dear All,

    The HARMAN Warmtone and Coldtone developers were conceived as giving further options to printers in relation to image tone. We developed and tested them extensively and launched....Warmtone went steller...Cooltone did'nt even sell out its initial production run, the stock went out of our quality time gateway and had to be destroyed...this period extended to 18 months.

    Our whole philosophy at HARMAN is to keep everything we make in production, which by and large we have done...films, papers and chemicals and in all formats and we are very proud of that, with chemistry you must have a viable manufacturing volume, matched to a specified sell through period, this is to ensure economic manufacture ( and a reasonable selling price for the consumer ) and to avoid stock write-off, Cooltone Dev, very regrettably never got to the first hurdle, never mind cleared it, so I need to be really honest here and say I cannot envisage that under any circumstances it will return. Sorry.

    Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :
     
  13. Mike Crawford

    Mike Crawford Member

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    I loved the Cooltone dev and have not found one that works quite the same with MGWT paper. I'm sure it's been asked before, but has there been any thoughts of supplying it as a powder developer which would have better storage possibilities?
     
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  15. steven_e007

    steven_e007 Member

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    If it is never, ever to return,

    is there any chance of (and any harm to Harman by) giving us a hint as to what the magic component might be that made Cooltone uniquely 'cold' ?

    Benzotriazole, as recommended in the usual developer cook book formulas, just doesn't have nearly the right effect... :sad:
     
  16. Simon R Galley

    Simon R Galley Subscriber

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    I promise I will speak to the powers that be to see if they will release the IP around the product.

    Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :
     
  17. brian steinberger

    brian steinberger Member

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    I have used Moersch SE6 Blue developer with MGWT and WOW! It cools it down amazing well. And the best thing is that when selenium toned it goes a cool gray instead of the reddish browns it normal does with other developers. However, I'm not using this developer anymore though, my reason is that it is just too expensive. I've since gone to the Ansco 130 formula, omitting the potassium bromide, upping the carbonate slightly and adding 15ml of 1% sol. of benzotriazole per liter of developer. I thank Evan Clarke for this recommendation. This works great on MGIV and cools down MGWT slightly.
     
  18. zsas

    zsas Member

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    I agree that Moresch exists as an alt but that price is a bit out there! Thanks for posting your Ansco 130 BZT/carbonate route. Brian is this the same brew that Evan Clark uses too? Might have to mix me some

    It sure would be fun if Simon comes through with the magic ingredient(s), I can imagine it being exotic like tears from a blue unicorn procured on the evening of a blue moon whilst the unicorn listens to....blues.

    Thanks Simon for checking!
     
  19. brian steinberger

    brian steinberger Member

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    Andy, yes this is the brew that Evan uses. He dilutes 1:3 for 2 minutes and uses it at 73 degrees, mostly with MGWT I beleive. I have used it 1:1 and 1:3 but develop for 3 minutes with MGIV to get the coldest tones I can. After selenium toning for 6-7 minutes at 1:9 it is very coolish, a nice look.
     
  20. zsas

    zsas Member

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    Very nice intel! Memo pad out, notes taken! Formulary order in effect! Thanks
     
  21. acroell

    acroell Member

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    I have used both Cooltone and Moersch SE6 (with and without "finisher blue" aka Benzotriazol) with Adox' MCC 110, and while both give nice neutral-cool results, Cooltone gave cooler results and the better Dmax on that paper. With no amount of Benzotriazol could I cool the SE 6 result to the Cooltone result. I still have three bottles and wish it would come back.
     
  22. zsas

    zsas Member

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    Have you done gold chloride toning after the Cooltone and Moresch dev?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 21, 2011
  23. Roger Cole

    Roger Cole Member

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    Wow. I wish I'd have bought some of this before it went away. In the past I've favored cool tones but just happened to finally get on a warm tone kick for some images recently.

    Anyone compare it to LPD diluted for cool tones? (Exactly dilution depends on whether you mix LPD from powder or buy the liquid, which is twice as concentrated as the stock mixed from powder.)
     
  24. DREW WILEY

    DREW WILEY Member

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    These kinds of cool tone developers are quite easy to formulate using commonly avail chem. Most
    are generally either MQ or PQ tweaks a bit heavy on Q and substituting benzotriazole for KBr. Plenty of them in older literature. I cooked them up all the time for Polygrade V, which didn't respond well
    to amidol. Gold toning is really a supplementary technique, applicable to a number of paper and
    developer combinations.
     
  25. acroell

    acroell Member

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    Not on these prints, because I selenium-toned them. Can't do that when I gold-tone them first. I have done gold-toning before, but it is an expensive proposition, especially right now with the gold price that high up, and it does not look the same. Over the years I have used several cold-tone developers, in addition to the Moersch SE6, there were Tetenal Eukobrom, Clayton Ultra Coldtone, and Amaloco 3003. All were good developers, but Ilford Cooltone was in a league of its own. For Ilford Warmtone, I get similar results with Ansco 130, but no replacement for Cooltone.
     
  26. zsas

    zsas Member

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    Acroell - Sigh....of course the "best" is no longer avail!