Ilford Pan F plus in Kodak HC-110

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by slm, May 15, 2005.

  1. slm

    slm Member

    Messages:
    55
    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2005
    Location:
    Montreal, Ca
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Hello Everyone,

    I was hoping someone could help me out with an easy dilution (maybe 1:50, or 1:100)
    of HC-110 to develop Pan F Plus. I've been using Rodinal for everything, but have now
    decided to give other developers a try. From what I read, I can expect finer grain.
    If you have any comments on the combination, please feel free to share them !

    I'm hoping to get very fine grain, to enlarge (condenser enlarger) to 11x14

    Thanks
    Steven

    (Note: I'd like to work directly mixing from the concentrate, as a one shot developer)
     
  2. Earl Dunbar

    Earl Dunbar Member

    Messages:
    558
    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2004
    Location:
    Rochester, N
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Hello/Bonjour Steven:

    I used to develop FP-4 in HC-110 dilution B and get very nice results; but it's been quite some time so I cannot recall times/temp, etc. But you might also consider Ilford DD-X. Folks I respect on the OM list speak very highly of it with respect to both grain and tonal scale. I have the concentrate here but haven't used it yet. I have some rolls of APX 400 and Tri-x that will get the DD-X treatment.

    I do like Rodinal and FP-4 for tonal scale and midrange separation.

    Earl
     
  3. david b

    david b Member

    Messages:
    4,031
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2003
    Location:
    None of your
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    I'm not sure HC-110 will give you what you are looking for but you might try xtol 1+1.
     
  4. Gerald Koch

    Gerald Koch Member

    Messages:
    1,670
    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2004
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    HC-110 dilution E is 1+47 and the Unofficial HC-110 website http://www.covingtoninnovations.com/hc110/ says to use a development time 50% longer than what is recommended for dilution B. Simply dilute HC-110 1:50 and develop Pan-F+ at EI 50 for 6 min @ 68F/20C. HC-110 is very syrupy and is best measured using a medicine syringe designed for cough syrup. They are available in pharmacies for a buck or so. Do not make up the stock solution that Kodak recommends. HC-110 will keep for years undiluted but once diluted to make the stock will keep only a few weeks.
     
  5. slm

    slm Member

    Messages:
    55
    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2005
    Location:
    Montreal, Ca
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Thanks Gerald. So if I wanted to try 1:100 dilution, would I just double the time ?
     
  6. Tom Stanworth

    Tom Stanworth Member

    Messages:
    2,027
    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2003
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    If you want very fine grain, HC110 is not the best IMO. Paterson Aculux 2 is very fine indeed, as is Ilford perceptol and the like. Both will give very smooth tonal transitions. HC110 is a medium to fine grain developer and will not be poles apart from the rodinal on this aleready fine grained film. Pan F in Aculux 2 is totally grainless and silky smooth, but lacking in edge. HC110 represents the middle ground in terms of grain., with Perceptol/MicrodolX and Rodinal at the other extremes.
     
  7. Gerald Koch

    Gerald Koch Member

    Messages:
    1,670
    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2004
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    The HC-110 website suggests multiplying the developing time by 2.5x for dilution F (1+79). It also states that you need a minimum of 3 ml of concentrate to develop a roll of film. At 1:100 you would have only 2.5 ml for a 1 roll (250 ml) tank which would not be enough. I suggest that you not go past dilution F. Alternatively you could mix 300 ml of working solution and use a 2 roll tank with an empty reel in the top position to prevent pistoning. I typically use the 1:50 dilution with excellent results.
     
  8. slm

    slm Member

    Messages:
    55
    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2005
    Location:
    Montreal, Ca
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Thanks again. I'll give the 1:50 a try.
     
  9. Jordan

    Jordan Member

    Messages:
    590
    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2004
    Location:
    Toronto, Can
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    HC-110 diluted 1+63 has worked for me with Pan F. I developed for about 7 mins at 24C.
     
  10. Andy K

    Andy K Member

    Messages:
    9,422
    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2004
    Location:
    Sunny Southe
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Another vote for PANF in DD-X. Shot and developed the attached with that combo.
     
  11. NikoSperi

    NikoSperi Member

    Messages:
    576
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2004
    Location:
    Italy
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    5'45" in HC110E (1:47) for Pan F at 40 EI. I like it.
     
  12. slm

    slm Member

    Messages:
    55
    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2005
    Location:
    Montreal, Ca
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Thanks Jay, will be interesting to see. I probably have the opportunity to get 3-4 bottles of HC110 at a 50% discount, one of the reasons I'm asking about it. From what I've read, unopened bottle will last in the order of 4 years, maybe more. Also have other chemicals available, such as Ilford Rapid fixer, Kodak selenium toner. Anyone know how long these can last, unopened ?
     
  13. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

    Messages:
    2,130
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2004
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    HC-110 will last for decades unopened and perhaps just as long even if you do open it. I'm working on a bottle that was unopened (I think) for who knows how long and it works just fine.


     
  14. Donald Qualls

    Donald Qualls Member

    Messages:
    1,845
    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2005
    Location:
    North Caroli
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Adding to that, last week I finished off the last of a bottle of concentrate I opened in December 2003. Worked fine, "Good to the last drop" as Maxwell House used to say. I did subdivide it into 4 ounce bottles when I opened the big one, but I'm not sure that really matters; at one point, one of the small bottles, partly full, sat undisturbed for almost four months (during a period when I was moving instead of shooting and developing film).

    Makes me wish I'd gotten more than one 28 ounce bottle when a local camera store was closing and selling it off for half price.

    FWIW, I'd expect fixer concentrate to last pretty well unopened; there's really not much to the stuff (ammonium thiosulfate, sodium sulfite, and acetic acid). I recently used the last of a bottle that was opened and partially used about a year ago; seems to work fine, though there were a few crystals of something floating on the surface after mixing. Selenium toner is even simpler and ought to last approximately forever, even in an partially filled bottle.
     
  15. craigclu

    craigclu Subscriber

    Messages:
    869
    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2002
    Location:
    NW Wisconsin
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I usually take a flash shot of the pantry next to my darkroom when I'm running a film test. The blown highlights in the Mason jars and the details in the labels make a consistent reference point and help confirm what I'm seeing in the step shots, too. Jay asked me to post some recent PanF shots that I sent him while checking out the HyperCat concentrate. I've had some flat toe trouble with FP4 and HP5 that wasn't so noticeable in the PanF but is still there. I'll be experimenting with a lesser amount of BZT to see if that's what's holding back the shadows. I'm very pleased with all of the other aspects of the results, though.

    The second shot is a 1200 dpi neg scan reduced to post and the other is a 4800 dpi scan of the center oyster cans to show details. My scanner isn't the best but even in the originals, the grain is very difficult to discern but the edge is still there for holding detail.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited by a moderator: May 19, 2005
  16. photobum

    photobum Member

    Messages:
    421
    Joined:
    May 18, 2003
    Location:
    Northern Vir
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    The best negative I ever got from Pan F for no/little grain was with Perceptol. This was with studio lighting indoors. Outdoors, YMMV.