ILFORD Replies / DELTA 25 asa

Discussion in 'Product Availability' started by Simon R Galley, Jun 4, 2007.

  1. Simon R Galley

    Simon R Galley Subscriber

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    Dear All,

    At long last I have had the chance to get the 'full heads up' from our marketing director, I have to tell you its not the news I guess you were all hoping for.

    ILFORD Delta 25 will not be made in the forseeable future ( but never say never ) and the explanation just issued is as follows.

    'Significant work has been carried out technically and in respect of market place positioning of a 25 asa film from ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited.

    The expected full R&D, time to launch and manufacturability for an entirely new controlled crystal growth 25 asa 120 and 35mm film has been estimated at 18 months to two years. To recoup the cost of this would require a film costing significantly more than the current DELTA 100 and DELTA 400 emulsions. As we also make a 50 asa conventional emulsion film ( PAN F + ) the market research clearly indicates that we would see the sales of this product reduce significantly, especially against a back drop of all film sales not growing.

    Therefore marketing have decided that we will serve the end user better by keeping our current range INCLUDING PAN F + , rather than introduce a more expensive film at 25 asa and have to cease making PAN F+ ' .

    I have to say, I do agree with them, I know how many people use and like PAN F + and I would not want to see it go and 'replaced' by a much higher cost film.

    I am sure many of you would have loved to see this film, I would have as well, I am sorry that it was just not viable at this time for ILFORD Photo.

    Simon : ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :
     
  2. jstraw

    jstraw Member

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    Makes sense, Simon. Thanks for the update.
     
  3. DBP

    DBP Member

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    Makes sense. I've become a real fan of Pan-F and find it is replacing my use of T-Max 100 and Plus-X.
     
  4. Jersey Vic

    Jersey Vic Member

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    Pan-F is a unique and fine product. Thanks for keeping us in the loop.
     
  5. david b

    david b Member

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    any chance of pan f in 4x5 ?
     
  6. pentaxuser

    pentaxuser Subscriber

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    To be honest I never really saw the photography rationale let alone the commercial rationale, given Pan F and D100 both of which are capable of further fine grain at EI 25 and EI 50 in Perceptol.

    Presumably the quest for even finer grain is based on enlargement beyond that possible with 35mm in such combos above. However beyond a certain point such a quest leads to MF or even LF as the better options.

    Like the rest, thanks Simon for the announcement and rationale.

    pentaxuser
     
  7. jovo

    jovo Membership Council Council

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    Is there any other company one can think of that is as straightforward and open even with 'bad' news than Ilford as represented by Simon?? What a revelation in corporate honesty. It's truly rare and refreshing.
     
  8. kjsphoto

    kjsphoto Subscriber

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    Makes complete sense.

    As long as their is FP4 and HP5 I am happy :smile:
     
  9. Chazzy

    Chazzy Member

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    Simon, since you have decided to stick with Pan F, is there any chance you could find a way to make it compatible with a sheet film base? Solving that problem might be easier than the research and development which you projected for a Delta 25 film, and then you would have Pan F available throughout the line, not just in roll film.
     
  10. Lee L

    Lee L Member

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    My thanks to Ilford simply for the time, effort, and expense involved in giving the project a chance, even if it didn't come to fruition, and to Simon for keeping film users in the loop.

    Lee
     
  11. Petzi

    Petzi Member

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    I don't care for FP4 and HP5 at all, but Delta 400 in sheets would be a product that I would buy.
     
  12. Petzi

    Petzi Member

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    It has been denied on APUG many times.
     
  13. BradS

    BradS Subscriber

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    No worries Simon. As long as there is an amble supply of FP4+, Delta 100 and HP5+ (especially in 4x5 and 5x7), I'm happy.

    Thanks and Keep up the good work!

    Brad.
     
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  15. Sportera

    Sportera Member

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    Pan f in 4x5 would make me a happy camper too!
     
  16. Alex Bishop-Thorpe

    Alex Bishop-Thorpe Member

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    Pan F+ in sheet film has been addressed many times before, along with the requests for 220 format. I don't know why it continues to dog so many topics...

    I've only recently tried Pan F+, and it's something I intend to buy bricks of if I ever have the money - I'd hate to see it go. So a sound decision, and thanks for keeping us posted.
     
  17. Chazzy

    Chazzy Member

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    I think it's entirely natural. If there isn't going to be a Delta 25, and the concern is to keep Pan F viable, then it seems all the more desirable to find some way to overcome the problem of putting it onto sheet film, and the research and development needed to do that might (I don't pretend to know) be a fraction of that which was contemplated for Delta 25.

    As for 220, I intend to continue asking for it. If you don't like it, shoot me. :smile:
     
  18. Mick Fagan

    Mick Fagan Subscriber

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    Simon, thank you for the positive way you have kept us informed, regarding the reasons for the decision!

    Mick.
     
  19. rpsawin

    rpsawin Subscriber

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    Simon,

    Thank you for keeping us informed. I appreciate the fact that you listen to us and make it a priority to communicate with us as well.

    Best regards,

    Bob
     
  20. steven_e007

    steven_e007 Member

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    Well, some of us haven't been here as long as the rest of you. I haven't seen it discussed since I joined and whilst I do use the search facility to try and find old threads, I haven't read the entire site... yet! :confused:

    But, Pan F+ in sheet would certainly appeal to me.
    Personally I find FP4+ a bit too quick for my ancient shutters and hand capped lenses!

    Steve
     
  21. Brian Jeffery

    Brian Jeffery Member

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    Thanks for the update. Pan F is one of my favourite films and I would hate to see in sacrificed for something that may or may not be better.

    A Wise decision indeed.


    Brian
     
  22. matti

    matti Member

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    Simon, I hope you don't regret telling about the plans, even though it didn't work out this time. I am soo happy with fp4+ and pyrocat right now. Now I got curious about Pan F...
    /matti
     
  23. Daniel_OB

    Daniel_OB Member

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    Live long ilford. I do not think you will ever pay off such research, run and investment in iso-25 Delta. Good news you guys reallized the same.

    www.Leica-R.com
     
  24. pentaxuser

    pentaxuser Subscriber

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    Steve. I think that there was a comprehensive reply from Simon Galley on why no chance of Pan F in sheet form quite recently. Maybe someone else will help out with the thread title

    pentaxuser
     
  25. Earl Dunbar

    Earl Dunbar Member

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    Well, Simon has stated emphatically that it won't happen. Would your prefer to be blindfolded for the firing squad? :rolleyes:
     
  26. braxus

    braxus Member

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    I guess what the others told me earlier last year was true, that this film won't come out.

    http://www.apug.org/forums/forum37/29598-delta-25-no-go.html

    But I was hopeful. Thanks anyway Simon for the update. It would be nice to see Pan F stick around. Funny thing is we can have a Delta 100 and FP4+, and Delta 400 and HP5+, but can't have a Delta 25 and Pan F+. Really shows how small the market is for slow speed film. Its a shame they couldnt make a Delta 25 just for 4x5, since Pan F can not be made in that.

    Anyway Kudos to Ilford for even considering making a new 25 speed film.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 9, 2007