Ilfotec HC dilution question

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by loman, Dec 22, 2007.

  1. loman

    loman Subscriber

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    Being a long a time rodinal user, I've gotten used to how easy it is.
    I just got some Ilfotec HC, and it states that you have to make a stock solution by diluting the one liter developer 1+3, and thereafter diluting it further to arrive at a working solution.
    It states in the fact sheet that you have to do this, because Ilfotec HC is difficult to dilute precisely from the concentrate.

    I must admit I don't get this.

    Is there any problem if I develop say one 35mm film and use the following method knowing that a 35mm film needs at least 290ml of developper in a paterson tank:

    take 3ml of concentrate
    dilute it 1+3 to arrive at a 12ml stock solution.
    thereafter dilute it furter 1+31 to arrive at a working solution of 382ml.

    The reason I'm asking this is that if I dilute the whole bottle of Ilfotec HC 1+3 to arrive at a 4 liter stock solution, it will only last half a year, whereas the concentrate can last almost indefinately, and considering how expensive it is in my country (35 pounds) I would like it to last as long as possible.

    I don't understand why it has to be complicated or a problem to only use a little concentrate at a time.

    Can somebody please explain this?

    Best Regards
    Mads Hartmann
     
  2. Ole

    Ole Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    I have no problems at all using a syringe to draw out the exact amount I need, and diluting that to a finished solution.

    I have a feeling that this advice is meant for those users who have no reliable way of measuring small volumes of very viscous concentrate.
     
  3. mikebarger

    mikebarger Subscriber

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    I'm with Ole, I use a syringe for HC110 and 510 pyro.

    No problems

    Mike
     
  4. GeorgesGiralt

    GeorgesGiralt Member

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    Hi Ioman !
    A laboratory guy I know which is using highly sirupy liquids said to me that the only precise method to measure such liquids is by weight.
    Illford for Ilfotec HC (and Kodak for HC110) knew that when they told us to mix the whole can into a 1+3 solution making an "ordinary" liquid and them go from there to get the working dilution.
    I've taken his advice for gold and, now, I weight all my HC110. My processing has become highly consistent and my HC110 keeps for a very long time (provided I reduce the size of the bottle containing it to keep with the reducing volume of chemical, leaving no air above the concentrate. This week I finished a bottle started in 2004.
    To take the concentrate I use a huge syringe (called a feeding syringe) total capacity 60 ml. Last trick, the syrup will stick to the bottom of the vessel so add a little water and stir well before adjusting to the final volume of chemistry.
    Hope this helps.
     
  5. GeoffHill

    GeoffHill Member

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    Why dont you make 100ml of stock solution, using 25ml of concentrate. 25ml is quite easy to measure acurately.
     
  6. Snapshot

    Snapshot Member

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    I use Rodinal and my own pyro concentrate. Like other in this thread, a syringe is used to ensure accuracy when apportioning out the required amount of developer. I don't believe there is a need to dilute your solution until you intend to use it.
     
  7. eddym

    eddym Member

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    Sorry, but I've never understood why people think it is difficult to measure HC110 "syrup" for single use dilution. I have a couple of Paterson 1-1/2 oz graduates, and measuring 1/4 oz. of HC110 to develop one roll of 35mm film is absolutely not a problem. I assume they are still available, but I could be wrong. Even so, I would expect something similar to be available from chemistry lab suppliers.
     
  8. Konical

    Konical Subscriber

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    Good Morning,

    Ditto to Eddy's comment; it's no problem at all.

    Konical
     
  9. GeorgesGiralt

    GeorgesGiralt Member

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    Hi !
    So, Monday I've bought a set of 5 10 ml syringes. And weighted them. They are in a .5 gr interval. I've written the found mass on them.
    Then I've put 6ml of syrupy HC110 on them and weighted the concentrate I've put into them. It is easy because I know how much each syringe weights.
    Guess what ? You'd better make the experiment for yourself ! I, for one, will stick to weight the concentrate ! I like to be precise and consistent !
    But you may think otherwise ;-)