I'll catch up one day!

Discussion in 'Rangefinder Forum' started by shadesofgrey, Jun 23, 2005.

  1. shadesofgrey

    shadesofgrey Member

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    Hi All. Call me slow if you like but is the R2 now out of production? Just had a conversation with a friend who says he’s thinking of getting one (borrowed mine for the day…hooked!) but they seem in short supply? Mind you; he could go for a Rollie 35 RF……OUCH!

    Cheers

    B.
     
  2. mikeg

    mikeg Member

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    Yes it is. Replaced by the R2a and R3a. You may still find one in stock somewhere, but take a look at www.cameraquest.com and www.robertwhite.co.uk for details and pricing. The differences between the R2, R2a & R3a have been discussed here before (take a look in the archive). They're also well documented on the camera quest website.

    Cheers

    Mike
    (A very happy Bessa R2 user)
     
  3. shadesofgrey

    shadesofgrey Member

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    Thanks Mike; short lived, the R2, I mean; considering the R is still around? Understand an up-grade up-date but why kill it off; sales? Interest? Thought it was still top of the heap, especially as the Rollie clone is so expensive an option. Like you I really enjoy mine; never thought I'd find a rival to my F5 or FM3a. Mind you; none of them come close to my COSMIC SYMBOL!!!
    All the best

    B.
     
  4. mikeg

    mikeg Member

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    I must admit I thought the R was also discontinued, although I couldn't find any mention of it on Steven Gandy's cameraquest site. It's been a while since I was on the CVUG mailing list, but I'm sure that one of the main reasons why the R2 was retired was because the shutter mechansim was discontinued by the manufacturer. This forced an update on CV. (I also thought the same shutter was used in the R which is why I believed it too was discontinued).

    Don't let the lack of an R2 put your friend off. The R2a looks even better.

    Cheers

    Mike
     
  5. livemoa

    livemoa Member

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    Thinking of selling my R2 if your friend wants a second hand one.
     
  6. shadesofgrey

    shadesofgrey Member

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    Hi Mike; yes, seems there are quite a few R's still about. Intresting; why the R's were kill'd off I mean. Was there something wrong with the shutter/design? seems a strange move? Brad (my mate) has gone looking for an R/R2 this weekend;I showed him you post, bet he comes back with an R2a.
    All the best.

    B.
     
  7. shadesofgrey

    shadesofgrey Member

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    Thanks for the offer David but he's set his heart on a new one.

    Cheers

    B.
     
  8. mikeg

    mikeg Member

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    I think the shutter is/was made by Copal and they pulled the plug on it for some reason. If you're really interested the reason will be buried somewhere in the CVUG mailing list archives over at Cameraquest. However, about the only thing I don't like about my R2 is the noisy shutter and the new one on the R2a is supposed to be much quieter.

    Let us know what your friend ends up with. What lenses is he interested in? I should have mentioned it earlier, so I may be too late, but if he's interested in the 75mm upwards end then he may be better off with the R3a. Whereas if he's a "wide angle" person then he'll want the R, R2 or R2a.

    Cheers

    Mike
     
  9. shadesofgrey

    shadesofgrey Member

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    Yeah, I know what you mean about the shutter; mines still as loud today as it was when I bought it, I’ve just become use to it, until I use my FM3a and then I think…hang on, this has a mirror and it’s……still, the R2 is a gem to use otherwise. Think the R seemed a touch louder (subjectively) as it had a plastic top. Funny that the R/R2 is defunct yet Rollie/Cosina are still producing the 35 RF…or are they? Nice but too much dosh in my view for an R/R2 with cosmetic/re-badge adaptation. Wonder if the shutter’s any better? Brad (he’s the one searching for an R/R2 might go for the R2a if can’t get either of the others, only he’s a ‘mechanical’ nut and the new Bessa’s are ‘BATTERY’ dependent. He’s into street shots so I guess he’ll buy a 35/2,5 with it. Just read the review of the R3A in this months Black & White; nice to see such an informative review in there again: Hicks and Schultz, the dynamic duo. Going to take a look at CVUG, see what I can find.

    All the best Mike


    Brian.
     
  10. Biogon Bill

    Biogon Bill Member

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    Actually, Brian, prices on the Rollei 35 RF have come way down from where they were when it first hit the market. About the same now as what the R2 was selling for & what the R2/3A sell for more or less. Very reasonable, especially considering that it comes with a 2-year manufacturer's warranty vs. the 1-year warranty on Bessas, which in some cases is essentially a store warranty.

    The shutter is the same because as you pointed out earlier, it is essentially an R2 clone. But there are some non-cosmetic differences. Close focus distance is 0.7 meters, an improvement over the R & R2, which are 0.9 meters. It is also a nice alternative to the R3A for use with the CV 40/1.4 Nokton because you can actually see the 40 mm frame lines even with glasses.

    I think that Rollei was aiming for the same concept as the Leica CL, i.e. a light weight 2-lens travel kit. Thus, the 40/80 lens combination. It's a nice concept actually. No frame lines are paired with any others, so the viewfinder is uncluttered. The choice of 80 as the long lens allows for a speed of f/2.8 with this base line. When Leica designed the CL with a long lens of 90 mm, they were restricted to a slow f/4 maximum aperture.

    Production of the Rollei 35 RF ended about a year ago at the same time that the R2 was discontinued. They are still available, however, while the inventory of R2's sold out long ago. Thus, the 35 RF & the Leica MP are the only all-mechanical rangefinders available on the new camera market.

    Bill
     
  11. Max Power

    Max Power Member

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    A slight hijack, but I have a question about the R2A/R3A shutters...

    A couple of weeks ago I was in my local photo shop when an elderly gentleman came in with a gorgeous M3. I commented that it was good for my soul to see someone enjoy such a camera. Long story short, I noted that I had just bought a FED 5 and that someday I aspired to an R2A. The salesman (who is a RF nut) said that the only 'problem' he had was that he found the shutter really loud, and noted that the shutter was derived from a Nikon SLR.

    Two questions, then. Firstly, is the R2A/R3A shutter really derived from a Nikon SLR? Secondly, although it is probably louder than a Leica, it must surely be quieter than an SLR, no?

    Thanks,
    Kent
     
  12. mikeg

    mikeg Member

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    Cosina made the entry level Nikon FE10 & FG10 SLRs along with SLRs for other companies such as Ricoh, Olympus, Vivitar and I believe the Canon T60. These were all based on the same body which used the mechanical Copal shutter. The Voigtlander L, T, R & R2 were based on the same SLR body minus the pentaprism and mirror. Cosina are very good at keeping development costs down by reusing existing products. They've got a huge amount of mileage out of that original design!

    As mentioned before, Copal discontinued their shutter so Cosina had to change to an electronic one which is used in the R2a and R3a. The old mechanical shutter is loud, about as loud as a moderately quiet SLR. Although it always sounds louder to me because as the user I'm holding the camera to my eye and therefore close to my ears! I've never known my subjects to complain about the noisy camera.

    I've never heard the new shutter so I can't comment but other people report that it is noticeably quieter, although still much noisier than a Leica.

    Cheers

    Mike
     
  13. shadesofgrey

    shadesofgrey Member

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    Production of the Rollei 35 RF ended about a year ago at the same time that the R2 was discontinued. They are still available, however, while the inventory of R2's sold out long ago. Thus, the 35 RF & the Leica MP are the only all-mechanical rangefinders available on the new camera market.

    Bill[/QUOTE]

    Thanks Bill; I really do need to catch up! Short lived? The 35RF I mean. What about the Phoenix; is that still about? Must be another manual RF out there? Nothing against electronics I have an F5 and worship it; but a rangerfinder has always engaged the meaning of simplicity: well; to me anyway.
    Brad; my friend who was looking for an R/R2 found an R; he’s over the moon. Must say, that apart from the plastic bits here and there is feels okay to me; I’d buy one for a spare body; might do that if there’s no alternative or a shortage of 35RF’s . Heard that the paint on the 35RF was not that good? You heard/seen anything to back this up?


    All the best

    B.