Input on E6

Discussion in 'Color: Film, Paper, and Chemistry' started by Lukas Werth, Feb 3, 2011.

  1. Lukas Werth

    Lukas Werth Member

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    I will have to start E-6 development. I live in a place where it is impossible to get slide film developed decently (if at all); I will even have to import the chemistry from abroad.
    I have looked at earlier threads on APUG and picked up some points; questions remain which I would like to ask to those experienced in the process.
    1) there seem to be two kits on the market: Arista and Tetenal; Kodak no more. Are they good, which is to be recommended? How do they keep? Are possible additions advisable, like a bath in formalin to boost permanence?
    2) temperature control: I don't have a Jobo, how far do I get with temperature control by a waterbath which I adjust to the desired temperature and then hope to keep reasonably stable until development is finished? Or do you think some mechanic devise is indispensible? Which are possible problems with the simpler method?
    3) Considering the fact that I will have to get everything from abroad, is it possible to make up the chemistry be oneself? Are there recipies?
     
  2. hrst

    hrst Member

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    There are also Fuji products that are readily available in Europe; e.g. http://www.ag-photographic.co.uk/process-e6-119-c.asp

    I'd use Fuji's 7-bath kit, as a real manufacturer and real process it can't go wrong... However I have had great results also with Tetenal's 4-bath kit too.

    Just use a water bath to keep the temperature, adding hot water every time it starts to cool down. During the First Developer, you probably need to add hot water only once. Then, the rest of the process is allowed to drift somewhat more. Fever thermometers work just on the correct temperature range and are precise. The average temperature during first developer is important and +/- 0.3 C deviation is well acceptable. Manual agitation just like with BW works, it's just more continuous, like agitating every 15 seconds instead of every minute.

    There are homebrew recipes, but they may not be perfectly accurate, you will need special chemicals, all in all, it will probably get even more expensive and won't be easy and quick. See; http://www.apug.org/forums/forum40/41974-e-6-reality-check-wikipedia-3.html

    I think we living in Europe have things surprisingly well. I've bought chemicals from AG Photographic, UK, with postage fee of 39 GBP up to 30 kgs, and still considered it quite bearable if you just buy as much as possible at the same time. You, living in Germany, will have much lower cost than that! We are lucky to have FujiHunt C-41 and E6 kits available here.
     
  3. Boggy1

    Boggy1 Member

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    Germany? But you're in the homeland of Maco!

    They do Fuji and Tetenal's E6 kit, as well as a whole lot more. :smile:

    Hope that helps!
     
  4. Mark Antony

    Mark Antony Member

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    "2) temperature control: I don't have a Jobo, how far do I get with temperature control by a waterbath which I adjust to the desired temperature and then hope to keep reasonably stable until development is finished?"

    Why not try a fish tank heater and a plastic washing bowl?

    Mark
     
  5. goldenimage

    goldenimage Subscriber

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    i loved the kodak kit, i was upset to see that they discontinued it, i now have the arista kit but havnt used it yet. i have dev lots of rolls of e6 and for the most part very consistant results, biggest thing is the temp of your chemicals especially first developer. good luck and post results.
     
  6. Lukas Werth

    Lukas Werth Member

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    Thank you for the answers. I should have mentioned this in my first post; I don't live in Germany any more, but in Lahore, Pakistan, and in this country there are hardly any analogue products any more. There is one E6 lab left (Fuji, I think), and you have to take or leave the quality they deliver. Even the roll films I use I import. I usually bring things with me when I come back from visiting Europe.
    Hrst, thank you for mentioning the 0.3 C plus or minus; I do think now I need some mechanical temperature control, or it will be all hazardous. What was that about a fish tank? Does an aquarium heating system work?
    And, I somewhere read about minilabes, does anyone have experience with them? Where are they sold?
     
  7. hrst

    hrst Member

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    Many people suggest aquarium heaters but you have to either modify one or find a very special one that goes to 38 deg. C. Most of them do not.

    If you have large enough water bath volume, such as tens of liters, cooling is slow enough so you don't need any regulating equipment, just a thermometer and hot water to add manually every 5 minutes or so.
     
  8. Diapositivo

    Diapositivo Subscriber

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    Aquarium heaters don't arrive to 38 °C. I bought a Hydor Theo Heater 200W, the temperature scale arrives up to 32 °C, I forced the handle to go past that point, and it went past it without breaking. I use it for keeping warm some rinse water, so I don't need exactly 38 °C, but I think it is certainly possible to find a position that heats your water at 38 °C and keeps it there. The site of the producer is www.hydor.com. I suppose you can easily buy it over the internet if you don't find it in Pakistan.

    Fabrizio
     
  9. PittP

    PittP Member

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  10. Lukas Werth

    Lukas Werth Member

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    Thank you for the input. I think I will have to get something made here for temperature control when I start E6. Pittp, it is heartening to see that you in Kenya work with analog material. I imagine the overall situation must be similar to here. One question: how do you use "camping gas" - I assume that's gas from a camping cylinder for cooking or light - to keep the chemistry? Do you replace with it the air in the bottles? How do you do that?
     
  11. nexus757

    nexus757 Member

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    I use the Arista 3-step kit in the U.S. which I believe is similar to the Tetenal. To process at 105F (40.5C) just get a bucket or (better yet) insulated cooler small enough to fit in your sink. I typically start by filling the cooler with water about 120F, fill the sink with water surrounding the cooler to the same temp, and submerge the bottles of E6 chemistry in the cooler. Let the temp gradually cool down to 105F to begin processing. I usually lower the water level in the cooler at this point so that the tank can be placed in the cooler between agitation. If the temp reaches 104, add a little hot water to bring it back up. One other bit of advice: do not try to process at room temps as the chart on the Arista instructions indicates you can. I have never gotten good results that way. It might work if you only use fresh chemistry every time and discard--but that is not very economical. Last night I processed my 12th roll at 105F in a 1-pint kit mixed up a month ago and the results were every bit as good as the first roll.
     
  12. boswald

    boswald Member

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    Are there no labs or suppliers in India? I know India and Pakistan are not the best of friends, but they
    are the closest of enemies. Alternately, you might try the German diplomats-one of them might put your film in a pouch, or bring in a tetenal kit with their computer supplies. I'll ask a Sikh friend what
    he would do. Good luck, anyway David
     
  13. Lukas Werth

    Lukas Werth Member

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    "Nexus757", thank you very much for these advises, they are very helpful. I might order the Arista kit from Freestyle, or alternatively the Tetenal from Germany. One point which worries me: I remember that in another thread concerns werre raised about the permanence of films processed in a 3-bath process. There was the advice of giving the film an additional bath in formalin. Do you know anything about this?
    "Boswald", there might be, but I suspect that in India as well as in Pakistan nearly everything is digital now, and the residues which are there might not offer acceptable quality. Further, India is a huge country, and one has to find the right place, which is the real challenge. And even if I do, the fact that India and Pakistan are not exactly friendly neighbors is likely to make things difficult to a point that makes it much easier to get something from the USA or Europe. I go once or twice a year to Germany, and many of my colleagues here travel regularly to the US. Anyway, thanks for the input.
     
  14. debanddg

    debanddg Member

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    Lukas -- the relationship between Pakistan and India has improved to a certain extent to what it used to be ;o). Coming to your point, there are labs in India [Delhi and in Ahmedabad, Gujrat] and also in Kolkata who do E6 processing for Euro 3 - 5 / roll. I can PM you their contact details and you can have a chat - all of them do mail order but better to check out from the India Pakistan and foreign currency angle. Since banks will take a cut [0.5% of the amount], they may be interested in a bit larger volumes.
    Cheers
    Deb
     
  15. heroic

    heroic Member

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    I use the Arista kit from Freestyle, and find it works very well if used fresh, then not quite so good after that.

    To control temperature, I use a plastic storage bin (the kind of thing you might put old clothes or toys into the attic in) with about 10cm of water at the bottom, and a fish tank heater. The heater is controlled from a digital controller sold for use in terrariums and electroplating baths- the pair cost me just under $100.

    This setup is nice because after I'm done developing, I empty the water out, wash up my containers, drum, etc., in the sink, and then put the spirals and stuff inside the plastic storage bin with the lid loosely fitted. They dry nicely without getting dusty. :smile:

    Here is a roll of velvia I developed in the Arista kit a few weeks ago. Sadly my scanner isn't really good enough to reproduce the depth of this film!
     
  16. PHOTOTONE

    PHOTOTONE Member

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    I developed E-6 for years using a deep tray, and 1/2 gallon bottles of chemistry, and just a regular mixer faucet to regulate the temperature of the water. I used a stainless steel film tank submersed almost all the way into the water jacket, as well as I kept the jugs of chemistry in the deep tray of water. No sweat, you need a very accurate thermometer. You just need precise temperature control in the first 3 steps.