Is Forte officially Dead?

Discussion in 'Product Availability' started by Jim Chinn, Aug 23, 2005.

  1. Jim Chinn

    Jim Chinn Member

    Messages:
    2,512
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002
    Location:
    Omaha, Nebra
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I can never keep all the changes in paper and film mfg straight. After reading the recent post about Lenswork the conclusion is that Forte is gone forever.
    I looked through the archives and cannot find any confirmation. I see that B&H still stocks it although that may be the last of the stocks. I also have seen psots from other sites and maybe here that they are still trying to reorganize.

    Anyone know the truth? I was going to buy a box of warmtone for printing some very old negatives but am not going to waste time and money if I cannot replenish when needed. I will just have to re-print the first two sets on Ilford.
     
  2. Nick Zentena

    Nick Zentena Member

    Messages:
    4,679
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2004
    Location:
    Italia
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I thought the last story was new shipments had started?
     
  3. Jim Chinn

    Jim Chinn Member

    Messages:
    2,512
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002
    Location:
    Omaha, Nebra
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I don't know what the real story is. Brooks says he has been told they are gone. Someone eles says the plant is shuttered. Others say B&H has been getting in new stocks, but at the same time Freestyle discontinued their aftermarket Forte Paper (arista edu?). I also have read thatr Bergger is no longer being produced and that was made by Forte.

    I have read on APUG that EFKE is seperate from Forte but on one of the RecPhoto forums they say Forte made their paper.

    So... Is Forte and Efke seperate entities?

    What are all the brand names of papers sold by J&C, Freestyle, Adorama etc. that Forte produced so if they are out of business I can steer clear of those.And send my send my business to Efke or Ilford or Agfa.
     
  4. Bob F.

    Bob F. Member

    Messages:
    3,984
    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2004
    Location:
    London
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Good question! I know Silverprint in the UK received bulk supplies of paper at the end of May. It does not help that the Forte web site (http://www.forte-photo.net) has no News section. Silverprint's News section says they came out of Administration, but it's not clear how up to date that news is other than sometime post May '05.

    Cheers, Bob.
     
  5. Nick Zentena

    Nick Zentena Member

    Messages:
    4,679
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2004
    Location:
    Italia
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Forte and Efke are in different countries. EFKE Croatia? Forte Hungary?

    Last story I heard was Omega [The US importer of Forte] had beening getting new shipments.

    At FreeStyle anything labeled Forte , the .edu. and Berger was supposedly made by Forte . I've no idea why FreeStyle switched but they also switched from Ilford and Ilford is still going. So I don't think FreeStyle switching means much.
     
  6. Peter Schrager

    Peter Schrager Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,075
    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2004
    Location:
    fairfield co
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    Forte

    I already posted this once today but I'll do it again. Both Adorama and B+H have Forte in stock. It WAS out of stock several months ago. Now it is again in stock.
    What does this tell you? Bergger IS Forte made to their specifications in the same plant.(Bergger also IN stock) I belive that Omega-Satter is NOT the importer anymore. What else do you expect their website to say? Let's all not buy Forte; that way we can be assured that they will certainly be out of business.
    My belief is that they are doing paper runs for people with cash. I'll bet money that Bergger which doesn't make a damn thing is in there right now with cash in hand. Otherwise wait and see. What do you think J+C 200/400 is? From Gupta, India. It's Forte....and so is the Bergger BPF 200;etc.....
    For my money I'll buy the Forte as long as it's around. These are individual choices one has to make but I'd rather be printing on Forte than Multigrade IV.
    Best, Peter Schrager
     
  7. Joseph

    Joseph Member

    Messages:
    28
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2004
    Location:
    Gloucester,
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Forte

    Have not been able to get Forte Polygrade V 16x20" although other sizes seem to be available.
     
  8. David A. Goldfarb

    David A. Goldfarb Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    17,946
    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2002
    Location:
    Honolulu, Ha
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    Forte is indeed in Hungary, and Efke in Croatia, and Foma in the Czech Republic, and Slavich in Russia.

    Maybe John from J&C has some news. He's been straightforward about such things all along. The only Forte product I use is J&C Classic 400. From the Efke plant I use Efke PL100 and J&C Exposition graded paper (which I formerly used under the Cachet label).
     
  9. Scott Edwards

    Scott Edwards Member

    Messages:
    128
    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2003
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I have been ordering Forte Polywarmtone Plus paper from J&C under the guise of "JandC Polywarmtone Plus". It is in stock and John says there should not be any availability problems in the foreseeable future.
     
  10. Monophoto

    Monophoto Member

    Messages:
    1,691
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2004
    Location:
    Saratoga Spr
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Peter's very profound point may get lost in all the words - - -

    if we don't buy Forte (and you can substitute any other brand you are interested in) our of fear that they are going out of business, then the self-fulfilling prophecy is that they WILL go out of business.

    I think the time has come to stop chattering about what might happen in the sensitized materials market, and concentrate our intentions on making pictures using sensitized materials. Suppliers will only survive if the market is healthy - and a healthy markets requires that there be customers to purchase the products offered in that market.

    Louie
     
  11. Bruce Osgood

    Bruce Osgood Membership Council Council

    Messages:
    2,612
    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2002
    Location:
    Brooklyn, N.Y.
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Help me out here,

    "JandC Polywarmtone Plus" = "Forte Polywarmtone Plus" = "Bergger VCCB".

    Or have I got this wrong too.
     
  12. Peter Schrager

    Peter Schrager Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,075
    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2004
    Location:
    fairfield co
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    Bergger

    Bruce-kindly read what I said about Bergger in my last post. VCCB is a very nice paper all its own.
    Peter Schrager
     
  13. Les McLean

    Les McLean Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,609
    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2002
    Location:
    Northern Eng
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    It's been common knowledge in the Photo industry for years that Forte have had ongoing money problems and required early payment even payment with order. They still struggle on and best wishes to them for the industry cannot afford for any of the manufactuers to close. Having said that there is too much coating capacity around so sadly it is inevitable that someone will go.
     
  14. Sponsored Ad
  15. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

    Messages:
    782
    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2005
    Location:
    St Paul MN
    Shooter:
    8x10 Format
    Is there a list of paper and film equivalence?

    I've heard Bergger is Forte, but also that Forte makes paper to Berggers specifications. Which in my mind make it different. Is this true with other products. Most of the information on these forums are confusing at best, contradictory at worst.

    It would be nice to have a chart or something.
     
  16. edz

    edz Member

    Messages:
    685
    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2002
    Location:
    Munich, Germ
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    That's the whole point, how else could one convince someone to pay extra for the same product. In side many of those paper boxes are other brands often at prices higher than the original brand. This has been the case for some Agfa papers but also for Ilford, Forte, Foma, Kentmere and Efke papers as well... Some companies that come to mind even invent their own factories producing pixie goods... It, of course, works the other way.. I know some local branded 35-mm colour film sold in drugstores at prices BELOW what the internal caculation from the producer is....
     
  17. Bruce Osgood

    Bruce Osgood Membership Council Council

    Messages:
    2,612
    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2002
    Location:
    Brooklyn, N.Y.
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Berrger is not Forte, though it may be made in the same factory and by the same people, but to different specifications as you note. To buy Forte thinking you will get a print that looks like Berrger is a mistake.

    Why would anybody in the paper industry publish a list of rebranded products?

    Who would publish such a list? Perhaps a third party would rebrand an already rebranded paper. But I would expect the third parties product, in order to be affordable, would have some kind of down size to it.

    I can use Forte and tell you it's just like Berrger, but you know better.
     
  18. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

    Messages:
    782
    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2005
    Location:
    St Paul MN
    Shooter:
    8x10 Format
    I agree it would be a mistake for a company to say we are selling this as this. My question was more pointed at the people here. It seems we can find everything else on the net. I also have not bought into Bergger being Forte. But then again maybe I just want to jusify paying extra for the Bergger.
     
  19. mark

    mark Member

    Messages:
    5,264
    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2003
    E-mail Jand C. They know a lot about this stuff.
     
  20. cesarb

    cesarb Subscriber

    Messages:
    25
    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2003
    A friend of mine have been talking to Bergger headquarters and says they're actually buying Forte, but I can't say if both brand will remain or just one. Bergger Warmtone is my favorite paper now and I'd say it's quite different from Forte equivalent, although both are gorgeous papers.
     
  21. mmcclellan

    mmcclellan Subscriber

    Messages:
    462
    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Location:
    Ann Arbor, M
    Shooter:
    4x5 Format
    Forte is Hungarian, Efke is Croatian. The Efke stuff is made near Zagreb, the Forte stuff outside of Budapest.
     
  22. aldevo

    aldevo Member

    Messages:
    895
    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2004
    Location:
    Cambridge, M
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    That story is incorrect. Omega no longer has any sort of relationship with Forte and they have not had any since Forte was placed in administration last October.

    As for B&H - they are now out of Forte Polygrade V glossy and apparently for good. I called their sales folks today and they report that they have no plans to place another order. They declined to give a reason.

    I think J&C Classic is the sole source of new Forte inventory (if indeed any is being produced) now.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 5, 2005
  23. Jon Shiu

    Jon Shiu Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,813
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2003
    Location:
    Elk, Califor
    Shooter:
    Plastic Cameras
    The latest Freestyle catalog has some info on "Arista.edu made in Hungary" product... "Anticipated Availability - Oct. 2005". On the cover they say "Forte is back. Hungarian Plant Reopens under new ownership." They list Polywarmtone Plus and Poly V Plus, each available in RC and FB.

    Jon
     
  24. Peter Schrager

    Peter Schrager Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,075
    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2004
    Location:
    fairfield co
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    Forte

    I have quite a bit in the freezer right now from when the crisis hit. Someone here have any communication with Bergger? Maybe I'll rustle up an email address
    and see if they answer. J+C does have it in stock right now. I notice John from there is keeping mum on this. Freestyle says October(?) That's less than 30 days away. This saga is just so pathetic...
    Best, Peter Schrager
     
  25. aldevo

    aldevo Member

    Messages:
    895
    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2004
    Location:
    Cambridge, M
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Well, nobody need despair quite yet. Calumet Photo is advertising new Forte inventory to arrive in October. And, of course, there is the FreeStyle advert for paper arriving in October.

    I think Forte might be doing a couple of scheduled runs per year but may not be producing regularly. Who really knows, but I'm not ready to pronounce them dead yet.
     
  26. Christopher Colley

    Christopher Colley Member

    Messages:
    284
    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2005
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Just opened a package of Forte Fortepan200 4x5 I had laying around a few weeks ago, shot some photos, yet to develop them.. They could probably cut some costs by using less paper!