Jobo love

Discussion in 'Darkroom Equipment' started by ThomHarrop, Nov 21, 2004.

  1. ThomHarrop

    ThomHarrop Member

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    This has probably been discussed ad nauseam here but I wanted to add my .02 dollars anyway.

    I recently purchased a Jobo CPE processor to do black and white film. It is a dream. After initial testing I have been running large batches of film using T-Max developer with replenishment and it is great. I was a bit concerned when I got it that the agitation would be too intense and cause surge. It doesn't. I can put on a movie, get the developer to temp and just process 'til the cows come home. I can do 7 rolls of 35mm or 8 rolls of 120 at a time. (This is not a misprint, the reels can hold two rolls of 120 at once.)

    I HIGHLY recommend this to anyone who does black-and-white film at home or for a small studio. I have never been much into doing color. Until now I did black-and-white by hand. I will never go back. Once you get past the quirks of the Jobo you will love it.

    I had actually slowed down in shooting for fun. Now I can go out and shoot to my hearts content and know I am not going to be spending a week in the darkroom. I did 17 rolls a few days ago without even breaking a sweat.
     
  2. galyons

    galyons Member

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    I agree! It's great to read & respond on APUG while streaming Classical musical to the 25 RPM beat of my Jobo! It doesn't get better, well...almost :wink: !!

    Cheers,
    Geary
     
  3. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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    And how many men did it take to get the top off the tank you demo'ed in my room Geary?
     
  4. david b

    david b Member

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    I have a CPA 2 that I am thinking of selling. Watch the for sale section.
     
  5. galyons

    galyons Member

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    Well normally, I guess, it only takes 1 man, but it took SEVERAL of US!! :wink:

    Cheers,
    Geary
     
  6. bmac

    bmac Member

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    Are you talking about the lid on an expert drum? I almost knocked myself out a few weeks back using the jobo pump to remove a top.

    I seriously cant see anyother way I would want to process film. The Jobo is awesome.
     
  7. jss

    jss Member

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    normally i steer away from threads with titles like "jobo love" since it borders on the freakish side of photonerdism. but after seeing gary's setup, i can see why people like them so much. i was developing film in a combi-plan tank in a hotel room and wished i had a bit more automated setup. this is after i recently moved up in the world from processing one sheet at a time in trays.
     
  8. Shmoo

    Shmoo Member

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    Ah...may we all become Geary's brand of photonerd...great Pyro demo Geary!!!

    S
     
  9. mobtown_4x5

    mobtown_4x5 Member

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    Don't beat me up guys- but I have not gotten a Jobo because I use very minimal agitation on my 4X5 negs- don't they agitate constantly?
    Has anyone noticed a difference due to this or is it a non issue for you guys? Again, not dissing the Jobo, just curious...

    Matt
     
  10. jovo

    jovo Membership Council Council

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    ooops.....I thought it said: "Jovo love". Couldn't imagine any reason why it should.
     
  11. galyons

    galyons Member

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    Matt,
    Just a different agitation protocol. You build the constant agitation into the processing time. The Jobo provides for consistent temperature and agitation, one only has to nail down time. The processor is not an "end all", but definitely a convenient, consistent tool!

    Cheers,
    Geary


     
  12. Stan. L-B

    Stan. L-B Member

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    Hi Thom.
    I have been using my Jobo CPP2, with lift, for about a year now developing all formats and film types. I am only sorry that I did not invest sooner as the results are consistently to perfection with little effort.

    I agree however, about the expert drum release, but using the foot pump it is no problem even with the full size 24 X20" print/film drum.

    Now, it's your turn for some velvia processing - it really is worth it!
     
  13. ThomHarrop

    ThomHarrop Member

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    <Now, it's your turn for some velvia processing - it really is worth it!>

    Haven't done E6 for a long time. Might actually be fun. Do you have a current kit to recommend?
     
  14. Frank F

    Frank F Member

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    I use a small ball inflation pump, inflation needle and a rubber cork to use as a pump to take the top off an expert tank... wrks like a charm... and cheap!
     
  15. Fotohuis

    Fotohuis Member

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    The agitation of a Jobo is to much for a lot of B&W developers. (e.g. Rodinal, Tanol, AM50)
    For the best results I am using the Heiland TAS Filmprocessor, a very compact automatic tumbling machine, fully programmable with all parameters, seperate memory cards and suitable for Jobo, Patterson and Kindermann developer tanks.
    It also has automatic time compensation if you are not reaching exacly the 20 degrees C. temperature.

    Only one disadvantage: You can not buy it on e-bay, because it's a new developed product.

    Best regards,

    Robert

    www.FotohuisRoVo.nl
     
  16. Stan. L-B

    Stan. L-B Member

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    Hello Thom.

    Sorry for the delay getting back to you with your question.

    There are a number of very good kits on the market both in the US and UK.
    Ideal for short runs, those of about six film units.
    Although they vary a little as far as mixing, proportions and timings are concerned, all are simple.

    Naturally the temp. and timing are very important, particularly for the first development.

    The last E6 kit I used was by Patterson 'Chrome Six'
    Kodak also do an E6 Kit which is equally as good.

    Bear in mind that the chemicals used in this process are corrosive, so take care not to get bodily contact.

    Good Luck...
     
  17. ThomHarrop

    ThomHarrop Member

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    Thanks

    I will be careful. I used to do 8x10 Ektachrome on a hand line at NASA. The smell was the worst part for me. Using a processor should make it a real pleasure.

    Thom

    Bear in mind that the chemicals used in this process are corrosive, so take care not to get bodily contact.
     
  18. Ed Sukach

    Ed Sukach Member

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    I haven't run E6 for a while. I've used the Patterson 3 Bath kit, with excellent results. Some purists prefer the 6 Bath kit ... I've done that, but I really couldn't see any advantage over the 3 Bath.
    Lately, I been using Tetenal for C-41 and RA-4, for a number of reasons, the main one being shelf life... Tetenal seems to last considerably longer. Tetenal is generally easier to mix: instead of "25ml `A'; 12 ml `B' and 56ml`C', and water", it is 50ml `A'; 50 ml`B', and water. When I do E6 next, it certainly will be with Tetenal chemistry. I also appreciate the formaldehyde-free stabilizer.

    I use a JOBO CCP-2 as well - wouldn't think of any other way. BTW - I've screwed up before, by simply not setting the temperature correctly... I've been off as much as 4 degrees C - and I haven't seen massively disatrous results ... in fact *no* noticeable difference at all. I just do not think the process is as sensitive as some are led to believe.
     
  19. Wally H

    Wally H Member

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    Matt... The Jobo machine I use (ATL2000) has different agitation (rotation) rates...

    Thom... I'm interested in how you get 8 rolls of 120 processed at a time. The developer you use can do that many in one tank? My machine (ATL2000) has a limit of 1000ml per chemical per run. The developer I use (Photographer's Formulary TFX-2) recommends 500ml per 120 roll.
     
  20. Flotsam

    Flotsam Member

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    Yeah, that is a lot of of film area to process in a limited amount of solution. I'd be worried about over-running the capacity of my developer.
     
  21. ThomHarrop

    ThomHarrop Member

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    I run 7 rolls of 35mm all the time, not a problem yet. I haven't worked out the square inches but so far, no worries. I run T-Max with replenishment and it seems to handle the load with 1000ml of solution. I actually haven't run 8 rolls of 120. I was just stating the capacity of the system. I will have to look into it and make sure I can process a full tank. Thanks for pointing out the potential problem.

    Thom


     
  22. rjr

    rjr Member

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    Formaldehyde free stabilizers.

    Ed,

    "formaldehyde-free stabilizer" means nothing but that there is no formaldehyde in the concentrates or powder bag - but a pre-product of formaline. The moment you mix it the formaline will form.

    The formaline is in there to harden the gelatine and thus protecting the color dyes from humidity and resulted fading. You could swap the formaldehyde with other aldehydes...

    As long as you keep skin-contact as low as possible and work in a ventilated zone the formaline will do no harm to you - generations of phycists have bathed in it without much negative outcome to their health.

    Correction:
    Tetenal lists a "103294 Ecoline C-41 Stabilizer FF" at their Website - FF for "Formaldehydfrei". The MSDS lists the following as contents:

    2 Zusammensetzung / Angaben zu Bestandteilen
    Gefährliche Inhaltstoffe
    CAS-Nr. Symbol und R-Sätze des reinen Stoffes
    1-5 % Hexamethylentetramin
    100-97-0 Xn,F 11-42/43
    1-5 % Netzmittel
    9036-19-5 Xn 22-41
    0.05-2 % 1,2-Benzisothiazol-3(2H)-on
    2634-33-5 Xn,N 22-38-41-43-50

    But these Stabi´s aren´t used in the small 5l E6-kits! Those are what Tetenal lists as "102488 UNICOLOR STABILISIERBAD und Regenerator" which contains:

    2 Zusammensetzung / Angaben zu Bestandteilen
    Gefährliche Inhaltstoffe
    CAS-Nr. Symbol und R-Sätze des reinen Stoffes
    10-15 % Formaldehyd
    50-00-0 T 23/24/25-34-40-43
    1-5 % Alkylphenolpolyglycidolether
    68072-38-8 Xi 36
    Beschreibung: Stabilisierungsbad für fotografische Farbmaterialien

    I changed to using stabilizer for ALL my negatives and prints - to me it is the better photo-flo, films and prints drie much cleaner now.

    The Tetenal E6-3bath is a nice thing, very simple, very robust, the opened concentrates will last a year and longer (unlike Calbe/Euro-Jobo/Fuji-Hunt which is known for a much shorter shelf life (all the same, made by the dutch Fuji-Hunt)).

    The funny story is that it was formulated by a Tetenal engineer in his spare time, as a hobby. He tinkered with some ideas without official decrete and *bang - it worked and he sold it to his bosses. :smile:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 26, 2004
  23. Ed Sukach

    Ed Sukach Member

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    Yeah. Like that.

    I *like* the stuff.

    One thing I'd wish for is some of the Tetenal's dry C-41 and RA-4 chemistry - with their extended shelf lives - to become avaiable here in the United Sates. Seems that the storage times for the dealers/ distributors would be much less of a hassel, and shipping problems (hazardous materials) largely relieved. Wonder why they don't do that?
    Oh, BTW - Yes, I know about Tetenal's "Press Pak", but they have larger, less expensive kits that seem to bre more desirable.
     
  24. rjr

    rjr Member

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    Do you mean the Phototabs and the Photo Pearls?

    I remember that Ken Owens -when he still worked for Jobo- referred to why Jobo USA never imported them and looked it up.

    http://groups.google.com/groups?q=k...217221226.04673.00000515@mb-ct.aol.com&rnum=1

    It was for the cost - individual packaging and labeling for the USA was too expensive.

    Well, thats a thing of the past. Tetenal pulled the Photo Tabs in May or June 2004 from the european market, the sale numbers were to low - no wonder at the price they asked for them.

    Are you aware that the Tabs and Pearls are an offspring of the minilab division? Tetenal depeloped and manufactures them for a minilab producer (IIRC Gretag), they are meant for instant replenishment and are a relieve in handling. So production continues, just the small packs got axed.
     
  25. Clueless

    Clueless Member

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    Please elaborate on why Jobo processors don't do well with some developers, e.g., Rodinal etc. Is it based on the continuousness aspect vs. resting periods of "still" development? Or, perhaps on the high dilution and volume of solution limititation per tank? Jobo user would be most interested. TIA