Jupiter 8 or 3?

Discussion in 'Rangefinder Forum' started by Erik Petersson, Sep 13, 2011.

  1. Erik Petersson

    Erik Petersson Subscriber

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    Hi everyone,

    I am about to order a Russian rangefinder FED-II with lens from a guy outside Moscow, Oleg Khalyavin, that fixes and sells such cameras. The question is what lens to choose. Besides Industar 61, he offers Jupiter 8 (50 f.2) and Jupiter 3 (50 f.1:5). Which one should I choose? Both are well within my budget, so price is immaterial. Both are also fast enough. I would just like to ask you which one is more likely to be a good, reliable and enjoyable lens?

    thanks
    Erik
     
  2. mablo

    mablo Member

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    An old chrome Jupiter-8 in good condition is a nice catch. First two digits of the serial tells you the production year. The older the better. I have one from -56 and it's a fabulous lens.
     
  3. Erik Petersson

    Erik Petersson Subscriber

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    I asked the seller about accuracy, and he replied that

    "Jupiter-3 like it's "father" Zeiss Sonnar have a problem on closest distance on wide aperture... Even accurate adjusted RF may give some shift of focus... At other hand - FED-2 have a long base of RF and it really accurate..."

    So, he cannot guarantee that the Jupiter 3 will focus accurately at all times.
     
  4. mablo

    mablo Member

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    Old chrome Jupiters are relatively easy to adjust by yourself. Look for 'shimming a jupiter lens' on Google.
     
  5. X. Phot.

    X. Phot. Guest

    Here's some basic data. It may help.

    http://www.baierfoto.de/russobj/objektive.html

    Jupiter : http://www.baierfoto.de/russobj/objektive/jupiter.html
    Industar : http://www.baierfoto.de/russobj/objektive/industar.html

    I went through a number of lenses, a Jupiter 3, Industar 61N, Jupiter 8, Industar 22, and Industar 50 for use with a Canon RF and a Fed 4A. Minus the Jupiter 3, I still own these lenses. When I had the Jupiter 3, I was not particularly impressed with my copy (sharpness wise). Now that I have more experience with LTM cameras I wish I had it for retesting. The aluminum body Jupiter 8 is of fairly low quality (build wise), though it is definitely sharp enough for general use. It has no click-stops which is a real shame. I currently consider the Industar 50 the sharpest in this bunch, followed by the 61N, and then the Jupiter 8 and Industar 22. The two collapsible lenses, Industar 50 and 22 are made of steel and have the best body build IMO. Finding M39/LTM lenses with glass that is in pristine condition can take a bit of time and effort. But, they are out there. I ended up ordering three of these lenses through eBay sellers in the Ukraine.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 13, 2011
  6. Erik Petersson

    Erik Petersson Subscriber

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    So, I ordered both an Industar 61 and the Jupiter 8. Thanks for advice. We'll see how it goes!
     
  7. artfoto47

    artfoto47 Member

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    Speaking of Jupiter 8's, the one on my Kiev has a sort of 'stop' between 1.7 and 2 meters. Is this normal? i.e. the approximate distance for a head shot or just a glitch in this lens? Not a big deal, just curious.

    Bob
     
  8. samcomet

    samcomet Subscriber

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    any thoughts on the J9?

    Sorry for this not specifically J3 or J8 post but has anyone had any thoughts about the Jupiter 9 black body f2 on a Bessa R3a w/Leica adapter? thanks and cheers, sam
     
  9. buzzardkid

    buzzardkid Member

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    Waaay late to the party but here goes: on RFF 'the Master of Sonnar' Brian Sweeney posted that the black Jupiters in general are more sloppy in their optics than the earlier chrome lenses. As said above, get the Jupiter-8 and Jupiter-3 with as early a serial number as possible (first two digits show year built).

    Brian shims them to match Leica standards, to which the Bessas are also built. Without getting too technical, when shimming and thus optimizing for close up and wide open, the increasing DOF when focusing farther away will cover the focus error and as a result you can have a lens that is spot-on both near and far. The whole optics module just threads out with aperture and all, it does on Jupiters -3, -8, -9 and possibly -11.

    :wink: Remember, SLOBB = Silver Lens On Black Body = cool. It just oozes professionalism :whistling:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 26, 2011
  10. gb hill

    gb hill Member

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    Good choice on the J-8. I have both an 8 & a 3. I use on my Bessa R. The 8 was reshimmed for the Bessa when I got it. The 3 I reshimmed myself. It front focused badly. Now it's dead on.
     
  11. Red Robin

    Red Robin Member

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    My J-8 is a fairly new one '61 the older J-3 was made in '59. My J-9 is also a '59. The ones I see listed for sale on the sale sites must all be the newer ones as they mostly seem to hide the serial numbers. Don't see many "old" ones coming out of the former Soviet Union at the bargain prices of even a few years ago. I use mime as is as I can't afford to have them "Brianized"and I'm afraid of making them worse right now. All in all they're good lenses I just don't know if any could be better.
     
  12. randomm

    randomm Member

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    The J-3 and J-8 are very easy to shim as there is only one shim to play with. You basically grab the lens from both ends and unscrew the optical block from the focusing block. Focusing block is the one with the screw mount. The shim goes between the two parts. Very easy.

    Only real problem with this may be if the lens has not been taken apart for, say, 50 years, then they might be a bit stuck together. I recently made a 0.8m close focus mount following Brian Sweeney's instructions on my own J-3 and it took some courage and grip to unscrew the two halves from each other!

    I have adjusted these with shims cut from paper as I do not have access to ones made from metal (tips welcome!). The J-9 is a whole different kettle of fish and I believe Brian Sweeney is correct in stating that may be impossible to make a J-9 to focus correctly from 1.15m until infinity on a Leica body. After playing with mine for many hours (there are two shims that you need to play with in a J-9, one between the two blocks like with J-3 and J-8 and another one with which you can adjust the focal length of the lens) mine is now correct from about 1.8m until infinity.

    Edit:

    ps. Hello to everyone from Helsinki! I used to lurk around RFF quite actively but as RFF seems to have vanished I thought to start lurking here instead!
     
  13. StillKicking

    StillKicking Member

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    Probably repeating what others have said and maybe too late but here goes. I own all three lens - the I-61, the J8 and the J3. My favourite is the J8.. its fast, sharp enough and produces surprisingly good results. The J3 is prone to flare (at least mine is) but has a lovely soft classic look wide open.. stopped down to f8 its sharp and contrasty. I tend to use it at night and for portraits.. otherwise the J8 live on the camera. Both are good. The I-61 good too but I prefer the J8 for most situations.. nothing specific.. I just prefer having that extra stop.
     
  14. goamules

    goamules Member

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  15. Brian Legge

    Brian Legge Member

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    Brians price for working on a J3 is exceptionally good. If you have one that doesn't focus and you aren't comfortable working on it yourself, definitely get in contact with him.

    I started out with a very nice J8 and eventually moved to a 1962 J3 when I found myself wanting more speed and more bokeh in some shots. The J8 from Fedka was great as is but the J3 purchased on ebay was slightly misfocused. He adjusted it and it is now an excellent lens. Fast, light, small, very nice sonnar image quality, etc. Both lenses can be excellent if you find the right one.

    J3:
    6170958897_e6e8ca5caf_b.jpg

    J8:
    5792877774_d5a0e65d7b_b.jpg