Kodak Concedes Difficulty in Drawing Lead Bidder for Patents

Discussion in 'Industry News' started by Prof_Pixel, Jun 12, 2012.

  1. Prof_Pixel

    Prof_Pixel Member

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  2. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    The question has to be what Patents do Kodak hold that competitors want to buy. First they are going to see how they can get around them, and then if they can't will weigh up whether a company in Bankruptcy (OK Chapter 9) could afford to take them to court anyway.

    I'm quite sure that Kodak could either licence or sell off Patented technology but at the moment it looks like a fire sale and Patents are not tangible assets.

    Ian
     
  3. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    and didn't they just lose a court case against apple ( and another ) involving patent infringement ?
     
  4. RattyMouse

    RattyMouse Subscriber

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    I don't see this situation helping film one way or the other. I think we all are clouded in our vision in that there is tremendous hope and desire to see Kodak stabilized and keep film going. Certainly an admirable hope, that is for sure. However, the reality I suspect is different. I see Kodak doing nothing more than everything it can to extract cash out of the decaying corporation as it heads towards final oblivion. Unless I am wrong, there is no plan for the future, no plan for growth, just systemic cashing out across the board, returning to share holders as much money as they can before the company is completely worthless.

    I have been part of a corporate take over. My company was bought out by a competitor. Me and my colleagues all rationalized an infinite number of scenarios where we would keep out jobs. All of these situations made great sense and it was a "no brainer" that we would survive. The buying company had an awful building, ours was brand new. The buying company had no space for growth at their facilities, ours was loaded with extra space, etc. For nearly a year we lived with these rose colored glasses and then it was announced our facility was closing, with virtually everyone losing their jobs. The buying corporation never had any intention at all to move. They just bought us and shut us down. Took our customer list, and left.

    Not the exact same situation as Kodak's bankruptcy, but there are some similarities regarding corporate behavior.

    I just dont see any planning Kodak has for a future. Selling off their CCD division was proof positive to me that they have no intention remaining a relevant player i the digital world. Printers? Yeah, Kodak is going to survive going up against HP, Canon, and Epson. I dont think so.

    Someone has to buy the film division and fast. That is the only hope for Kodak's film.
     
  5. Newt_on_Swings

    Newt_on_Swings Member

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    Dumb moves by Kodak, chasing after patent infringement is not a way to increase earnings or to fix their bottom line. I wonder how much they are spending on lawyers which they could be throwing into R&D to actually make something that adds value to the company.
     
  6. RattyMouse

    RattyMouse Subscriber

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    It's not a dumb move if your goal is to extract as much cash out of a dying company as quickly as possible. As I wrote above in a different post, the goals of Kodak might be clear for us to see if not colored by the tremendous hope that they survive as a film company.
     
  7. jnanian

    jnanian Advertiser Advertiser

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    i believe they won decisions in similar patent infringement cases in the last few years
    so they thought it was going to be another sure thing, and it would bolster their portfolio ...
     
  8. Newt_on_Swings

    Newt_on_Swings Member

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    Now everyone that wants a piece is just a vulture sitting by the wayside or circling. They can wait and drag these things out, litigation always takes forever. Kodak on the other hand cannot, and will more likely run out of liquid assets or not get another loan guarantee to fund these expensive patent infringement cases.

    Also who will ultimately hold these patents if the do collapse even after attempted restructuring? That's another question that other companies may be asking aswell. How low in price will Kodak go if no one is interested in the current price. It may get up to a point where these companies they are suing may find it cheaper just to buy the rights than prolong the fight in the courtroom.
     
  9. RattyMouse

    RattyMouse Subscriber

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    Is there any timeline for Kodak to exit bankruptcy or is that to be determined?
     
  10. zsas

    zsas Member

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    ^ Thought the timeline was 1 year, so maybe that puts it early 2013.

    Another ruling today, the judge didn't dismiss Apple's claim that they own 10 of the 1000 patents, so it looks like all 1000 patents will be auctioned, just 10 of them Apple is going to go after when the new buyer takes over these 10 disputed ones. Ultimately that baggage lessens the price of the portfolio since 10 of the patents will land the new owner in court upon the closing it sounds...
    http://www.nasdaq.com/article/judge-denies-kodaks-bid-to-declare-apple-doesnt-own-patents-20120613-01165
     
  11. zsas

    zsas Member

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    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 22, 2012
  12. c6h6o3

    c6h6o3 Member

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    Ilford will be the sole manufacturer of quality film in the end. I buy Ilford film and shoot it and I'm confident that I'll be able to do that for many years. Kodak? I couldn't care less. The world has moved on. Let's us do the same.
     
  13. Roger Cole

    Roger Cole Member

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    I really like Ilford products and the company and I will join your thinking when they start making color neg film like Portra and Ektar and slide film like Provia (and, please, E100G, E100VS and Astia!)

    Black and white us my main interest and love but at least 1/3 of my shooting is color. No help from Ilford there.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 23, 2012
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  15. Newt_on_Swings

    Newt_on_Swings Member

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    From what I have been reading in the paper, this will have a large impact on that portion of the portfolio. The other half has to do not with image capture/display, but on the technology of sharing the digital images from what I understand and that part is sure to be worth a bit as well.

    This thing is such a joke right now, and with the board and Perez asking for bonuses, I hope that film really splits or is bought out by a team of more competent investors that see profit in it.
     
  16. Steve Smith

    Steve Smith Subscriber

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    If the patents Kodak have are so valuable, you would think they would be able to profit from the ideas themselves with the added bonus of not having to pay for them.


    Steve.
     
  17. PKM-25

    PKM-25 Member

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    ..……………wow…….
     
  18. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    The Kodak Ch11 issues must be resolved by Feb. 2013 or it goes into Ch8 (IIRC).

    Kodak owns some of the key digital patents outside of the Apple suit. The same is true of analog patents. The problem is that most buyers are scared away from buying the patents as if they do, they might face some sort of encumberment from Kodak debtors if the Ch11 fails.

    So, there is interest in the patents per se, but no one wants to be encumbered by such a large purchase.

    It is like finding some great property but with a tenuous deed. You are afraid to buy!

    PE
     
  19. RattyMouse

    RattyMouse Subscriber

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    Just more of a reason why there is almost no hope at all that Kodak will survive bankruptcy.
     
  20. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    Someone with a lot of $$ would do it if they didn't mind paying any of the debt that had attached to the patents as long as it did not erase any potential profit attached to the patents.

    PE
     
  21. RattyMouse

    RattyMouse Subscriber

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    Could Kodak sell the formula for Porta to Fujifilm for big bucks?
     
  22. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    It is published in a patent, so the answer is yes. However, they do use the words "skilled in the art" meaning that there are still some vague points in the patent. :wink:

    PE
     
  23. RattyMouse

    RattyMouse Subscriber

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    So one can assume that all this talk about Kodak selling patents does not involve the film ones, correct?

    A shame since whoever would buy the film patents would be the most interested in keeping it going.
     
  24. Ken Nadvornick

    Ken Nadvornick Subscriber

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    Please don't underestimate the level of people's frustration. A lot of us were counting on Kodak...

    Ken
     
  25. PKM-25

    PKM-25 Member

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    I still am, I am trying to be positive, support their products and help them out. There is a lot of ugliness and bitterness in the world, I can not live like that...
     
  26. Steve Smith

    Steve Smith Subscriber

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    As there should be in all good patents.


    Steve.