Kodak Flexicolor III Replenisher

Discussion in 'Color: Film, Paper, and Chemistry' started by Tom Taylor, Apr 1, 2010.

  1. Tom Taylor

    Tom Taylor Member

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    Hi all,

    I tool the plunge while it is still possible to do so and purchased the 12.5 gallon kit of Bleach III, Part A and Part B along with the Bleach Starter. So I won't have to worry about buying C-41 bleach at a reasonable cost for several years. Here's my questions:

    1. Instead of mixing 12.5 gallons of replenisher, I'd like to mix say 1 gallon at a time. If I do this would it be better to mix a 1 gallon working tank solution with starter or just 1 gallon of the replenisher and make a working tank olution as I need? I guess my real question is will the working tank solution have a shorter "shelf life" than the mixed replenisher?

    2. The chemistry came in blatter containers in which a kodak screw cap dispenser is used to dispense the chemistry. Does anyone have one they would like to see or know where I can get one?

    Thanks for your help.

    Thomas

    PS: The stockhouse I purchased from will ship and is located in LA and has 1 kit left. My total cost with shipping and tax was $232.00. PM me for their contact information if you're looking to purchase the same.
     
  2. brucemuir

    brucemuir Member

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    I think the keeping properties of c 41 bleaches are very good and if you process a reasonable amont of film you won't need to worry about it going bad.

    I'm sure PE will answer with more specifics but I dout you wil have a problem

    On a side note, I had problems sourcing the starter and just omitted it on the advice of members here and have had no issues due to lack of the starter.
     
  3. Tom Taylor

    Tom Taylor Member

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    Thanks for the reply Bruce.

    I don't expect the unmixed bleach to go bad (when I asked Kodak they responded with a 5 year shelf life but I'm sure that's the fall-back to length of time as they couldn't come out and say "indefinite" for obvious reasons) but what I am uncertain of is whether or not this particular bleach, when mixed as a tank solution ready to go, will last as long as their ready-mixed product. In other words did they add any ingredients to the latter to increase its shelf life? Rather than mixing a gallon of Replenisher, I'd rather mix a gallon of tank solution ready to use.

    BTW, you can get the starter from Calumet.
     
  4. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    I have seen the unmixed and mixed bleach both survive for 5 years or more.

    As for starter, it is not really needed with the bleach. It is used to just tweak the pH.

    PE
     
  5. brucemuir

    brucemuir Member

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    I ended up with some off brand imitation Bleach III off ePrey that was fairly cheap so I scarfed up 10 gallons and it has been discontinued.
    They had their own starter but after asking here I just decided to say screw it and run some tests/expired film through it but it works well and I replenish a half gallon working solution and then I pull what I need for a dev session from that 1/2 gallon.

    The nice thing about it is that you don't have to worry about oxidation/air with the bleach as I understand it and the Kodak Bleach III even calls for aeration... so I shake my bleach once in a while but I'm running small inversion tanks so I figure it gets aerated with agitation.
    (holy runon sentence batman)

    Wonder what we'll do when the Kodak stuff gets discontinued.
    Your experience just goes to show what a hassle and expense it is to get now.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 2, 2010
  6. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    If it gets discontinued, I just happen to know the formula!

    So there!

    PE
     
  7. Tom Taylor

    Tom Taylor Member

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    Thanks for the replies.

    I'm going to mix it as a tank solution by the gallon. That's how I use to purchase it before they discontinued the 1-gallon ready to use product which cost ~$25.00/gallon. I'll have to mix this but the the price of 1-gallon drops from the $25 range to $17.47 or $4.60/Liter - not enough of a saving to motivate me to switch before they discontinued the ready to use product - but surely now when the replacement cost me $38.95 + tax for 2.7L or $15.83/Liter!

    PE: Don't forget to post that formula on this forum when it is discontinued or you, heaven forbid, pass away. Make sure that is in your will!

    Thomas
     
  8. RPC

    RPC Member

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    You could always go with a ferricyanide bleach. Easy to buy and mix and cheaper.

    RPC
     
  9. thisismyname09

    thisismyname09 Member

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    Now if only we could find a source for the chemicals... I'm having a hell of a time finding ferric ammonium EDTA (much less the PDTA that's used in bleach III). I managed to accidentally order ferric ammonium sulfate from the photographers formulary instead of EDTA; they don't seem to carry ferric ammonium EDTA anymore.
    I need to stop buying things so late at night.
    The only other place I found that sells it is in china, and they only sell it by the 250kg barrel or more!
     
  10. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    But the process is far more complex. You need an set of washes and a clearing bath.

    As for NH4FeEDTA, the Formulary probably still has it. Since it is a low demand item it is not in the catalog. They may have run out though and may not wish to reorder in bulk for one user.

    Anyhow, I know how to get around that.

    PE
     
  11. thisismyname09

    thisismyname09 Member

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    That's good news. I almost hope it gets discontinued, since I can't find it (in reasonable amounts, at least) anywhere anyway.

    As for the ferricyanide bleach, what kind of clearing bath is needed? I know I read, here or elsewhere, that ferricyanide bleach requires a good wash before and after, but I haven't heard anything about a clearing bath.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 3, 2010
  12. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    The correct cycle is this.

    1. Develop
    2. Stop/clear = stop bath + sulfite
    3. Good wash, not just rinse
    4. Ferri bleach
    > Note, if you get stains or your fix goes bad, you need a clear here as well.
    5. Good wash
    6. Fix
    7. Wash
    8. Stabilize

    PE
     
  13. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    How to make Ferric EDTA:

    Take 1 mole of Ferric Chloride
    Add 1.1 mole of EDTA acid

    With stirring and mild heat, add 28% Ammonium Hydroxide until the pH = 6.0

    You will have an excess of Ammonium Chloride which will make the bleach about 20% less reactive and less soluble

    The goal at the end is to have about 40 - 60% Ammonium Ferric EDTA in 1 liter, so judge the water carefully.

    Wear safety goggles, rubber gloves and a lab coat or old clothes during this process.

    PE
     
  14. thisismyname09

    thisismyname09 Member

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    Just in case anyone was wondering, I emailed the photographer's formulary about ferric ammonium EDTA. I was told that they can't get it anymore, so anyone interested in making their own bleach has to go with ferricyanide or use the the procedure PE posted to get Fe EDTA
     
  15. Tom Taylor

    Tom Taylor Member

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    I E-mailed the following question about Flexicolor III Bleach and recieved the reply yesterday:

    1. Instead of mixing 12.5 gallons of replenisher, I'd like to mix say 1 gallon at a time. If I do this would it be better to mix a 1 gallon working tank solution with starter or just 1 gallon of the replenisher and make a working tank solution as needed? I guess my real question is will the working tank solution have a shorter "shelf life" than the mixed replenisher?

    A: It would be up to you to decide which you would rather mix. It all depends on your needs. As for the life span of the chemistry, a working solution does have a slighty shorter shelf life. Bleach III, however is about 8 weeks for both, so no real advantage in doing either. All about personal prefernce.
     
  16. RPC

    RPC Member

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    Eight weeks? Quite different than the 5 years PE said in an earlier post.

    RPC
     
  17. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    Kodak gives them 8 weeks. Bleach is quite stable. I have kept it for over 5 years with no problem.

    PE