Lens for Beseler 23C II for 5x7 from 6x6?

Discussion in 'Darkroom Equipment' started by omaha, Sep 3, 2013.

  1. omaha

    omaha Member

    Messages:
    349
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2013
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    I've got a 50mm and a 105mm, but was surprised to discover last night that I can't enlarge on 5x7 paper (so really that means taking my 6x6 negs to 5x5 in) without cropping. The smallest I could get was maybe 6x6 in.

    What lens do I need for this?
     
  2. Jon Shiu

    Jon Shiu Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,821
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2003
    Location:
    Elk, Califor
    Shooter:
    Plastic Cameras
    Hi, do you have the 105 on the extended lens board?
    It's seems like you just need a little more bellows extension.

    Jon
     
  3. pschauss

    pschauss Member

    Messages:
    234
    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2002
    Try to find a 39mm thread macro extender. I have not looked recently, but several of the FSU sellers on Ebay used to list sets of these from time to time.
     
  4. TheFlyingCamera

    TheFlyingCamera Membership Council Council

    Messages:
    9,546
    Joined:
    May 24, 2005
    Location:
    Washington DC
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    The "normal" lens for 6x6cm is an 80mm. But I'm confused by what you mean about you can't print on 5x7 paper without cropping. Are you trying to make 4x4 prints, or are you trying to make 5x7 prints?
     
  5. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

    Messages:
    17,174
    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2005
    Location:
    Delta, BC, Canada
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I am confused by this.

    Are you trying to do this with the 50mm lens? If so, you need to try the 105mm lens.

    And with 6x6 negatives and the 105mm lens the usual problem is with the image being too small, not too big.

    If it is the 105mm lens you are using, is your problem related to the amount of bellows travel available when focusing? I could be wrong, but I seem to recall that the condenser adjustment available on the 23CII can affect that.
     
  6. omaha

    omaha Member

    Messages:
    349
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2013
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Maybe it was operator error. Bottom line is that the smallest I could get and still achieve focus (using the 105mm...the 50mm was far, far worse) was about a 6"x6" image.

    I'll try fiddling with the enlarger to see if I missed something. Failing that, I guess I'm either shopping for a new lens or an extender.

    Thanks!
     
  7. TheFlyingCamera

    TheFlyingCamera Membership Council Council

    Messages:
    9,546
    Joined:
    May 24, 2005
    Location:
    Washington DC
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Not to be insulting, but have you tried the ultra-obvious of moving the head lower on the column?
     
  8. omaha

    omaha Member

    Messages:
    349
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2013
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    LOL! Yeah, that was the first thing. I found that I ran out of "focus room" when I had the image at the desired size. The only solution I could come up with was to print somewhat larger (the 6" square) and accept the cropping.
     
  9. Jon Shiu

    Jon Shiu Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,821
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2003
    Location:
    Elk, Califor
    Shooter:
    Plastic Cameras
    Do you have the 105mm on an extension board? It moves the lens downward a bit for closer focusing.

    Jon
     
  10. omaha

    omaha Member

    Messages:
    349
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2013
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    I don't think so. The board is flat, so I assume that means it is "standard"?
     
  11. Jon Shiu

    Jon Shiu Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,821
    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2003
    Location:
    Elk, Califor
    Shooter:
    Plastic Cameras
  12. omaha

    omaha Member

    Messages:
    349
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2013
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    That's definitely not what I have.
     
  13. NedL

    NedL Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,893
    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2012
    Location:
    Sonoma County, California
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I've got the original Beseler 23c, and can just barely print a 6x6 on 5x7 paper w/ my 105 lens. It's right at the edge of what's possible. It's been a while, but I seem to remember bringing the bellows to full extension and then having to work back and forth between the focus and elevation knob. Several of my prints have the rebate, so there must be at least a tiny bit of wiggle room... but it's a close thing. If the bellows on the 23cII are even a tiny bit shorter, then you'd need that extension....

    Actually, I just looked and I think it was my 6x9's that were at the edge. When I print 6x9 ( or 35mm ) I leave a little strip along the top and bottom, so it's even less enlarged than a 6x6. Anyway, I've successfully printed 6x6 and 6x9 on 5x7 paper, for what it's worth.

    Good Luck!
     
  14. TheFlyingCamera

    TheFlyingCamera Membership Council Council

    Messages:
    9,546
    Joined:
    May 24, 2005
    Location:
    Washington DC
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Get an 80mm lens - the El-Nikkors are terrific and very reasonably priced. You really only need the 105 if you're working from 6x9cm negatives. You can use the 80mm on a flat lensboard.