List of Color Chemicals and Where To Get Them

Discussion in 'Color: Film, Paper, and Chemistry' started by Greg Davis, Jul 25, 2011.

  1. Greg Davis

    Greg Davis Member

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    Since this is asked all the time and information seems to be sketchy, I decided to make this list of chemicals for the C-41, E-6, and RA-4 processes. This is not a definitive nor a complete list, but it will give you a place to go with a solid shopping list. If anyone has other locations or brands to add, please do. Alternatively you can PM me with the information and I will edit this post to reflect it once I check it out and verify it. The information I have is for North America, but I will add other countries if you send me a link.

    C-41

    For small 1L kits I would go with the repackaged Kodak kit from Photographer's Formulary or the Rollei kit from Freestyle Photo. In Europe the Rollei kits are available from Maco Direct in several sized kits or as individual parts.

    Maco Direct also has available a 5 liter C-41 4 bath kit. Thanks to Diapositivo for the link.

    For larger volumes it makes better economic sense to buy in bulk, in which case Kodak recommends their SM line of the Flexicolor chemicals. These can be purchased at mini-lab suppliers such as Photo Finishers Supplies, Inc. Orders are shipped UPS Ground and are calculated by weight. There are no HAZMAT fees. Or Pakor, which does charge HAZMAT.

    The items needed for Flexicolor SM are:

    Developer #KOC1756337 to make 6 x 2L
    Bleach #KOC8824690 premixed 2 x 2.7L
    Fixer #KOC8462681 premixed 2 x 3.9L
    Rinse #KOC1925254 to make 12 x 1.5L

    No developer starter is needed. Each chemical is sold by the case which include the amounts listed above. Instructions for use can be found on Kodak tech sheet CIS-211.

    The items needed for Flexicolor LORR are:

    Developer Replenisher #444-0364 1 x 5 gal.
    Developer Starter #444-0375 to make 17.75 gal.
    Bleach #444-0401 1 x 5 gal.
    Fixer and Replenisher #444-0296 4 x 5 gal.
    Final Rinse and Replenisher #444-1044 2 x 75 gal.

    Instructions for use can be found on Kodak tech sheet Z-131. Thanks Ed Sawyer for the info.

    Trebla brand chemicals are available from Armadillo Photo Supply. They stock some older package sizes, so the ones listed here are current and what will be carried in the future.

    Items needed are:

    Developer #55DE550 to make 4 x 10L
    Developer Starter #55DE519 to make 1 x 1L
    Bleach #55BL563 to make 2 x 5L
    Fixer #55FX564 to make 2 x 10L
    Stabilizer #55ST595 to make 12 x 10L

    E-6

    At one time Kodak made a 5L kit for E-6, but I am unable to find a supplier. If someone has a link to one, PM me and I will add it here. Bulk sizes are readily available at mini-lab suppliers such as Photo Finishers Supplies, Inc. Instructions for use can be found on Kodak tech sheet Z-119.

    What you need:

    First Developer Replenisher #KOC8313611 to make 4 x 10L
    First Developer Starter #KOC1671577 to make 100L

    Reversal Bath and Replenisher #KOC1123611 to make 4 x 10L

    Color Developer Replenisher #KOC8372542 to make 5 gal.
    Color Developer Starter #KOC1858158 to make 25 gal.

    Pre-Bleach and Replenisher #KOC1286228 to make 6 x 10L
    Bleach Replenisher #KOC1965623 to make 1 x 5L
    Bleach Starter #KOC1779792 to make 25 gal.

    Fixer and Replenisher #KOC1545466 to make 3 x 10L

    Final Rinse #KOC8140279 to make 12 x 10L

    Trebla E-6 chemicals are available from Armadillo Photo Supply with the following quantities. The site lists some older package sizes no longer available, so I only listed the products still in production.

    What you need are:

    First Developer #20DE260 to make 6 x 10L
    First Dev. Starter #251-DE208S to make 1 x 25 gal.

    Reversal Bath #20RV261 to make 12 x 5L
    Color Developer #20DE262 to make 3 x 10L
    Color Dev. Starter #251DE209S to make 1 x 25 gal.

    Pre-Bleach #20CO263 to make 12 x 5L
    Bleach #20BL264 to make 6 x 2L
    Bleach Starter #251-BL210S to make 1 x 25 gal.

    Fixer # 20FX265 to make 6 x 5L

    Final Rinse #20ST266 to make 12 x 5L

    I will post the information for Fuji-Hunt products if someone sends them to me. I will also include a link to dealers in other countries if you provide a link.

    Available in Europe from Macro Direct is the Fuji Hunt 5 liter 3 bath kit.

    RA-4

    For home use the best all around developer is Kodak RA-4 RT chemicals. The easiest I have been able to find small quantities is Calumet Photo. Instructions for use can be found from Kodak tech sheet J-39.

    What you need:

    Developer Replenisher RT #8415580 to make 10L
    Bleach-Fix and Replenisher #8309031 to make 10L

    Larger quantities can be bought from mini-lab suppliers in quantities up to 75 gallons it you are using large machines.

    Maco Direct sells 1 liter Rollei RA kits, as well.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 25, 2011
  2. EdSawyer

    EdSawyer Member

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    I have had good success buying from Pakor.com. They will ship everything UPS. Hazmat applies in some cases.

    SM is really designed for minilabs. There's MUCH cheaper/better alternatives in the Kodak lineup for home-processing C-41.

    Here's what I usually order for C-41. (I use the 10L RA-RT as mentioned above for RA4):


    # 444-0296 - KODAK FLEXICOLOR C41 FIXER AND REPLENISHER, 5 GALLONS, 4 PER CASE, KODAK#1693837 $6.66

    # 444-0364 - KODAK FLEXICOLOR C41 DEVELOPER REPLENISHER, 5 GALLONS, 1 PER CASE, KODAK#1919042 $23.10

    # 444-0375 - KODAK FLEXICOLOR C41 DEVELOPER STARTER, MAKES 17.75 GALLONS, 1 PER BOX, KODAK#1953009 $4.50

    # 444-0401 - KODAK FLEXICOLOR C41 BLEACH, 5 GALLONS, 1 PER BOX, KODAK#1987924 $77.21

    # 444-1044 - KODAK FLEXICOLOR C41 FINAL RINSE AND REPLENISHER, 75 GALLONS, 2 PER CASE, KODAK#8486268 $34.00


    I re-use the bleach at least 2 or more times, using kodak bleach regenerator. The other chems I use one-shot. the C41 fix can be used for B&W paper and film fix, and is basically the cheapest fixer available anywhere.

    -Ed
     
  3. Greg Davis

    Greg Davis Member

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    These look to be the LORR series of Kodak Flexicolor chemicals. This is what Photographer's Formulary uses to make small 1 liter kits. It works great but requires a developer starter and is sold in different quantities than the SM. I didn't get it because they weren't offering the 5 gallon bleach at the time. It does look cheaper, so I may replace what I use as I use up my stock of SM.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 25, 2011
  4. little-infinity

    little-infinity Member

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    Great list!

    However some of the above options might not be feasible/economical for us Canadians who have to deal with border issues dealing with "hazardous" materials.

    I recall someone posted that LL Lozeau (a photo store in Montreal) was stocking 2L Flexicolour kits. I don't know if they're just the bulk versions, or pre-mixed C41SM chems. Can someone verify this? I don't see it available on their website. Also a member mentioned awhile back that a warehouse in Mississauga stocked Kodak Chems (though I don't know in what quantities).
     
  5. AlbertZeroK

    AlbertZeroK Member

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  6. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

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    Sticky?
     
  7. David A. Goldfarb

    David A. Goldfarb Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Good idea. This one can be a sticky.
     
  8. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

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    I think you are referring to Mike Wilde's post #22 about Unisource/Mondrian Hall in Mississauga in this thread:

    http://www.apug.org/forums/forum40/84588-where-purchase-c-41-chemistry-ship-method.html

    Unisource has depots across the country.
     
  9. Greg Davis

    Greg Davis Member

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    If someone will verify this with a phone call and PM me the answer, I will add it to the main post. Until then, it will only remain a rumor, and I want to avoid posting rumors and keep it to verified information with active links or phone numbers.
     
  10. Bob-D659

    Bob-D659 Member

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    Two things for Canadians:

    PhotoCentral.ca in Winnipeg stock and ship RA/RT RA4 chemistry in 10 liter sets.

    MondiranHall/Unisource sell only the 4 kit cartons, so you are looking at buying 40 liters of dev or Blix.
     
  11. little-infinity

    little-infinity Member

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    Whoops. I completely forgot that Mike's post was actually a reply to one of my own.... -_-

    As for the LL Lozeau thing, someone posted it in this thread not too long ago. I can't call cause of long distance. Can someone in Montreal confirm this? And get info on quantities/pricing/whether they charge hazmat?
     
  12. David Lyga

    David Lyga Subscriber

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    Canadians and US residents: PDISUPPLY.COM will answer your needs and prices cannot be beat. Service excellent. They are in Rochester, NY. - David Lyga
     
  13. SkipA

    SkipA Member

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    Optional chemicals for RA-4 that you may consider in addition to the Developer Replenisher RT #8415580 and Bleach-Fix and Replenisher #8309031

    Kodak Ektacolor RA Developer Starter #1026681 to make 25 gallons
    Kodak Ektacolor RA Bleach Fixer Additive #8036832 - 48 oz

    I'm just getting started on color printing, having done it only once before years ago. I don't have personal experience with any of the RA-4 chemicals listed here yet, but I'll have a shipment arriving soon.

    My understanding is that the Developer Starter creates a seasoned developer so that you don't go through the color shifts caused by aging of a developer that is mixed straight from the Developer Replenisher RT. The Bleach Fixer Additive provides added protection against oxidation of the bleach fix in a low-utilization system.

    I just bought all four of the above from Pakor. Pakor only sells the Developer Replenisher RT #8415580 and Bleach-Fix and Replenisher #8309031 in case lots (4x10L each). Shipping cost from Pakor was high, but overall cost was lower than if I had bought an equivalent quantity from Adorama. Unless you are going to consume a lot of the developer and bleach fix, it may not be worth the savings to buy from Pakor vs Adorama. But that's just my opinion.
     
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  15. EdSawyer

    EdSawyer Member

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    Further info

    Greg, those ones i listed for c41 arent LORR as far as i know. Just the regular c41 process as far as i can tell.

    Ed
     
  16. Greg Davis

    Greg Davis Member

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    You are right, Ed, but it won't let me edit the post anymore. As long as someone orders by using the sku numbers given, they will be alright.
     
  17. EdSawyer

    EdSawyer Member

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    Skip

    The upside of large quantities of ra rt from pakor is that it doesnt go bad really ...
    LAsts for years. I wish the shipping was cheaper too.

    Ed
     
  18. SkipA

    SkipA Member

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    I'm glad to hear about the keeping qualities of the RA RT chemicals, Ed. That's good news, because it could take me years to use it up. I just bought a CP-31 and I plan to make the most of it, so that may help.

    Do unopened C-41 chemicals have similar longevity?
     
  19. Mike Wilde

    Mike Wilde Member

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    I would not vouch for this being the official response, but here is what I have done with RA-RT to get over 4 years out of the RA-RT 4x10L.

    Transfer the developing agent containing concentrate into filled full small glass bottles. Read the storage guidelines. If it saye store something like 5-40C, well, make sure that the little bottles are as close to the lower end as you can. My fridge has in the past kept one bottle, but it did not seen any more or less active as an unfridged one that lived in my 18C basement after 3 years.

    Mix up just what you need. I worked out the proportions and just mix 2L at a time.

    For e-6 I have bits of the old 'makes 10L' kits from Kodak. Here the isolate the CD agent of the second developer into full glass has shown to work. One only 3/4 full after 4 years is a black tar; the other full bottles are the light amber they went in as, and still work fine.

    I have yet to buy commerical C-41 from Kodak, but the same strategy should extend whatever the rated life is.
     
  20. Rudeofus

    Rudeofus Subscriber

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    I have no idea why the Tetenal chems haven't been mentioned yet, so let me be the one who does. As far as color is concerned, they make C41, E6 and RA4 chemistry kits which are sold in central Europe. In Vienna, Austria there are two brick and mortar stores which have C41 and E6 in stock and if they are out of RA4 they will order it (especially Blende7). Numerous online shops also carry these kits.

    As far as Ilfochrome is concerned, I found a retailer in Graz which will order the Ilfochrome chemistry plus the paper upon request. While their webpage states they will not ship any orders, they will ship even internationally if you contact them beforehand (according to a phone conversation I just had with them).
     
  21. EdSawyer

    EdSawyer Member

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    SKip, good choice on the CP31. I have 2 of those, they are great machines. RA-RT keeps fine even in the orignal bottles, for years, in my experience.

    C-41 keeping: Developer is the only one of real concern here. I have the "makes 5 Gallons" developer from Pakor.com (about $26). I make 5L at a time, after figuring out the proportions. Part C (CD-3 or CD-4 ? ) is the one most prone to oxidation. I refill the concentrate bottles with inert gas and seal them with a layer of saran wrap between cap and bottle after mixing up a 5L batch. It's kept fine so far through 2 batches, about a year or so, using the above method. I need to mix a new batch soon so will have a look at it. If the Part C is discolored/dark at all, that's a good indication it's bad, from my recollection.

    Once mixed, I try to use up the C-41 batch in a week or two if possible. The longest I think I kept a mixed batch of C41 developer without it going bad was about 6 or 8 weeks, but that was a stretch and it was pretty oxidized and not working great by the end. I save up my shot film now and run the whole 5L at once within a week or so, if possible. (5L = 48 rolls of 120 or 35mm, via a SuperSidekick4. )

    -Ed
     
  22. Diapositivo

    Diapositivo Subscriber

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    Tetenal chemistry is also available at Macodirect.de

    They have
    E-6 three-bath kit (two sizes, 1 litre and 5 litres). Uses blix;
    C-41 "Rapid kit" (two sizes, 1 litre and 5 litres). Uses blix;
    RA-4 kit, 5 litres.
    There's also a low formaline stabilizer, suitable for E-6 and C-41.
    http://www.macodirect.de/chemistry-tetenal-c-416_404_535.html

    Depending on availability, the same chemistry can be ordered in Italy at Western Photo:
    http://www.westernphoto.it/pagina_principale/category_tree,16_20

    Shipping from Germany to Italy and within Italy was carried normally, did not involve any "hazardous material" complication.

    Fabrizio

    PS for those interested, Western Photo also has the Ilfochrome paper developer:
    http://www.westernphoto.it/prodotti/ILFORD_ILFOCHROME_P30_sviluppo_carta_ILFOCHROME
     
  23. RPC

    RPC Member

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    As has been posted before by myself and others, developers will last a lot longer if stored properly. If stored in glass jars ( I use canning jars) filled to the top and tightly sealed, developers can last years and only slightly change color. I have both C-41 and RA-4 developers I mixed in 2008 that are still giving excellent results. Rather than mix from concentrates as I need developer, I mix a whole batch and store it away.

    RPC
     
  24. little-infinity

    little-infinity Member

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    So did anyone get a chance to try the Flexicolor 2L kit? Is it SM?
     
  25. Greg Davis

    Greg Davis Member

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    What 2 liter kit?
     
  26. little-infinity

    little-infinity Member

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    Someone posted here that some store in Montreal had some Flexicolour 2L kits in stock. I didn't even know such kits existed. The only small Kodak Kit I've ever heard of was the Formulary 1L kit. If the rumour is true, then this would be the first time small-kit Kodak C-41 chemistry would be commerically available in Canada. (There are some suppliers who sell it in bulk but the cost doesn't justify the volume of film some of us are shooting, and due to border hazmat costs, we are forced to use blix kits for the most part).

    That's why I was asking if somebody could verify is such kit even exists, and the pricing. It would be really nice to know if this is true, or if it's just a rumour.