Looking for info on Bienfang 360 and rice paper

Discussion in 'Alternative Processes' started by reellis67, Dec 15, 2005.

  1. reellis67

    reellis67 Subscriber

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    I am working on making salt prints that need to be translucent so I wanted to see if anyone has ever tried to use Bienfang 360 paper or rice paper to make salt prints. The 360 layout paper is nicely translucent and it has been suggested for other alt processes, but I can't seem to find much info on it in regards to salt prints.

    As for the rice paper, apparently it wrinkles when it gets wet but it can be ironed flat again using an iron on a cool-ish setting. Other than that, the only info I found was its use as a printmaking paper. It appears to be generally unbuffered, but I haven't found any pH info so far...

    Generally, what I am looking for is this:

    1) Has anyone used either of these for salt prints?

    2) Has anyone found that either of these need to be sized for salt printing?

    3) If so, how much of the translucency is lost once sized?

    I know that rice paper is likely not one of the more commonly used papers for alt processes, but it was recommended by someone who's' opinions I find most valuable so I want to a least try to get some info before discounting it.

    Anything anyone can supply on this would be greatly appreciated. I plan on doing some printing/testing with both papers, but if anyone has anything they want to share, it would probably save me time, and more importantly, money. The main concern I have is translucency, so if you have any ideas for other translucent papers, I would love to hear them as well.

    Thanks in advance!

    - Randy
     
  2. Jim Noel

    Jim Noel Member

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    I have tried SAlt prints on a variety of papers, including rice paper, but not Bienfang.

    The most success I have had with alt images on translucent paper is when I use high quality vellum which is available at stores catering to architects. It wrinkles very little and stands up to the long immerision times associated with most alt processes. If necessary, it can be ironed flat, but I have not found that necessary.

    Jim
     
  3. reellis67

    reellis67 Subscriber

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    I have quite a bit of that on hand right now, but never considered it before. I will have to give that a shot as well, thanks!

    - Randy
     
  4. Jeremy

    Jeremy Member

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    Randy,

    I have printed pt/pd on Clearprint Vellum before with good results. The trick (as shown to me by Clay Harmon) was to tape down the paper and coat the ENTIRE thing--this really seemed to help with the potato chip effect of the paper curling.
     
  5. Don M

    Don M Member

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    I have used a gampi tissue paper for in camera paper negs .I don't see any reason it couldn't be used for salted paper prints,although you might want to go with something heavier than the tissue.it comes in a variety of weights,and unlike rice paper doesn't wrinkle.

    The tissue I had to "glue" to a glass support using albumen,which sometimes came "unglued" during the developing/wash process,which really wasn't a problem.Results were interesting,and somewhat grainy.

    I get my papers from-

    Bookmakers International ltd.
    Jessup Md.

    they have an online site,which I don't have the link for
     
  6. marko_trebusak

    marko_trebusak Member

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    I'm experimenting with Canson Opalux. It's a tracing paper, nicely translucent and quite thick for tracing paper. When wet, it winkle like crazy. To get around this problem, I'm using old watercolour paiter's trick: immerse paper in water, lay it flat on support (I'm using glass), and tape it down with brown gum tape. You have to be careful, because when drying this paper shrink unbelievably. I have to use two layers of tape, because if only one layer would be used, it would crack!

    Marko
     
  7. reellis67

    reellis67 Subscriber

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    Thanks! I was concerned about it curling so I will have to try your method of keeping it flat. How did it dry after all was said and done? Flat or curled? The application I will be using will have small prints bordered on all sides so the curl should not be a problem, just wrinkles.

    As to the thickness Don and Marko mentioned, I need it to be as thin as possible. The idea is that it will be lit from behind. A second sheet of uncoated paper with watercolors applied will sit behind to provide color to certain areas. The end result should be that when it is viewed from the front it will appear black and white and when viewed from behind the color from the rear sheet will show through the image.

    - Randy
     
  8. reellis67

    reellis67 Subscriber

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    One more thing, did you find that sizing the paper was required?

    - Randy
     
  9. Don M

    Don M Member

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    Randy-


    have you ever seen an old expensive book with illistrations ---like an old Bible-- in front of the illistration is a piece of tissue-

    that's gampi tissue


    it doesn't get any more transparent than that,however if you use tissue,you will need some kind of support.

    As for sizing---I never used any, but I had the tissue embedded in albumen. This paper is so thin,I would suspect that the chems will soak through-sizing or not.

    I don't think that would be a problem,as the purpose of sizing is to keep the chems on or near the surface of the paper.Gampi tissue is probably thinner than a gelatin coating.
     
  10. reellis67

    reellis67 Subscriber

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    I am familiar with it, but was not aware of it's name. Very cool, thanks. I am ordering supplies for testing so I will have to get some gampi tissue as well. I am recreating an old photographic product that used three layers of tissue, the front being the image bearing layer, the center acting as a diffuser, and then the rear, which bears color. The originals I have in my collection have no support because it would interfere with the light transmission, but I might be able to use a stiffer paper for the diffuser layer, something like drafting velum, to add support if needed. Thanks again for the info.

    - Randy
     
  11. Don M

    Don M Member

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    I'm not exactly sure what you're doing--

    but I think you would only have to use a support during processing---gampi is remarkably strong for its weight (dry).I would think you could sandwich the papers between two matts or four or five if you need spacing.

    It's been a long time since I bought any,but I know Gampi paper comes in colors(Japanese Lanterns)--not sure about the tissue.