Making your own glow film?

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by EASmithV, Apr 3, 2012.

  1. EASmithV

    EASmithV Member

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    Hello,

    I was wondering if anyone has tried washing off the antihalation dye in a 35mm or MF film prior to shooting it to give it a good glow effect?

    The easiest way to do this would be to shoot some Aura IR820 without a filter, but that's a bit more expensive for a film with kinda unreliable effects, if you're not using it for IR.

    So, has anyone tried / how easy would it be to do a pre-wash for a roll of film, and have it dry in the film tank?

    I've had film tanks where the light trap was on and they didn't dry for weeks... So Does anyone have an idea for doing this effectively? How about taking a Paterson tank and a hair dryer and forcing hot air through it's center hole?
     
  2. dnjl

    dnjl Member

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    That's an interesting thought. I wouldn't do the hairdryer method, you'll get more dust than silver on your film. I guess the best way to dry them would be in a dark room, or perhaps in a cotton changing bag supported by some sort of improvised drying rack.
     
  3. Terry Christian

    Terry Christian Subscriber

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    I've heard of using a portable closet as a film drying rack. So I'm wondering, how about taking a black garment bag, the kind that's used for suits, and using that to hang the film to dry once you've rinsed off the antihalation layer? Of course, once you hang the film in the garment bag, you'd have to seal off the hanger slot and any other places light could leak in. I'd also worry about the wet film sticking to the inside of the bag, but maybe using an extra thick hanger and weighting the end of the film would help.
     
  4. Ken Nadvornick

    Ken Nadvornick Member

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    If you have access to a sheet film camera for testing it might be easier to try it using a single sheet. I would think that a short immersion in a dilute sulfite solution followed by a water wash (and careful handling) should do the trick. Then perhaps drying in an old paper safe so the lights can be turned on. If the sulfite solution becomes tinted you should be good.

    Ken
     
  5. donkee

    donkee Member

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    For 35mm try some Polypan F. I just started playing with it and notice the glow.
     
  6. Gerald C Koch

    Gerald C Koch Member

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    How do you propose to wash out any antihalation dyes but leave the sensitising dyes untouched? If the film uses an antihalation film base -- this dyd cannot be washed out.
     
  7. erikg

    erikg Member

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    Quite a lot of dye comes out in a presoak with no harm so no reason you couldn't do that preexposure. drying part is the trick. Hanging would be best, maybe in a closet? That polypan is a good option too, rather glowy already.
     
  8. Newt_on_Swings

    Newt_on_Swings Member

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    Lots of older films do not have the anti-halation layer. Some from eastern europe and china have minimal coatings. You can probably get the glow effect with any film if the pressure plate or backing was more reflective. You can try covering the plate with a shiny material and expose regularly. Aluminum tape comes to mind if you have a spare camera or back/plate combo to test with.
     
  9. DarkroomExperimente

    DarkroomExperimente Member

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    can you remove the sensitizing dyes just by washing?

    this could be interesting...I have always wanted to use a film that only had the sensitivity to UV & blue

    I have a large drum for processing prints...could easily leave a reel of film in there & let it dry...
     
  10. dehk

    dehk Member

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    Why? just get some Lucky SHD 100.
     
  11. darkosaric

    darkosaric Subscriber

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  12. Athiril

    Athiril Subscriber

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    Someone did that with some IR film on flickr, and it worked, they didn't lose the IR sensitivity.


    People say lucky b&w doesn't have antihalation, not sure if that's true or not.
     
  13. werra

    werra Subscriber

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    135 and 120 Lucky SHD glow for sure. No experience with sheet formats.
     
  14. georg16nik

    georg16nik Member

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    Another vote for Polypan F 35mm, its finer grained than Efke IR820, Lyckies and so on.
    Its offered as bulk in cans, whatever lenght You need and that means You have to roll Your own.
    Some folks say its the industrial version of Ilford Pan F (sans antihallation).
     
  15. chuck94022

    chuck94022 Subscriber

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    If you roll your own film from bulk, I think you could make it easier on yourself. Just roll a very small number of frames worth (like 3 frames). Why would you want to shoot through 24 or more for a specific effect anyway? Before you use the film, wash it in the paterson, then rig up a dark place like a changing tent (plenty of room if you have a really short segment of film). Maybe put in something really dry with the film (plate of salt, dry sponge?) in the changing tent to absorb moisture, keep the humidity down.

    Of course, your ratio of frame to leader goes to hell, but just how many "glow effect" shots do you plan to make anyhow, before it becomes a cliche in your portfolio?
     
  16. Rick A

    Rick A Subscriber

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    Orthochromatic film would work best for the "halo" effect. It can be handled under a proper safe light instead of total darkness, plus it tends to glow a bit anyway.
     
  17. JBrunner

    JBrunner Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    As far as washing black and white film goes, there are no "dyes" to wash off except for the AH, so it should work. Sheet film would be by far the easiest. Trying to roll up film that has been washed and dried without damaging it sounds a lot to me like trying to stuff toothpaste back into a tube, but I dunno fer sure, ya? Somebody try it!!!
     
  18. georg16nik

    georg16nik Member

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    For 35mm or roll film, a PVC tube with spacers/holders for the film on both ends + light/water traps should do it.
    Load the film in the tube, fill it with distilled water, dump, refill as you like, then remove the light traps and a drying cabinet with holders for the PVC tube should let it dry, even if it might take some more time than normal.
    If You care to try TriX or Tmax wihtout the AH, probably the above might work..lol
     
  19. DarkroomExperimente

    DarkroomExperimente Member

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    so does prewashing do anything to sensitizing dyes, or not?
     
  20. holmburgers

    holmburgers Member

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    It seems reasonable that they wouldn't wash out that readily, seeing as they're adsorbed to the silver crystals quite tenaciously. AH dyes on the other hand are designed to wash out as easily as possible.
     
  21. erikg

    erikg Member

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    No change that I have seen. The base is something to consider, film on a polyester base like HIR was will pipe light more.