My Brick leaks. (three images)

Discussion in 'Rangefinder Forum' started by Stephanie Brim, Aug 25, 2006.

  1. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    Edit: Hosting went down for a bit, so added them as an attachment.

    But can you tell me from WHERE? I'm puzzled. It may be something else, too, but I have no clue what.

    And for the uninitiated, the "Brick" I'm referring to is an Argus C3.
     

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    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 25, 2006
  2. david b

    david b Member

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    I don't think it's a leak. It looks like the film got bent and created a "crescent moon".
     
  3. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    It's the same place on every single frame, though...bending the film the same place on every frame is kind of unlikely, isn't it?
     
  4. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    Edit: It seems like the most likely explanation, though. I'm going to have to test another roll of film to see. I'll have to do it tomorrow, though, since we ran out of daylight about four hours ago.
     
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  5. copake_ham

    copake_ham Inactive

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    Stephanie,

    It get progressively worse with each shot.

    Does your "brick" have a dual shutter and is one tearing?

    Maybe you should go back to RFF? I'm sure they miss you there and probably have a greater expertise in this gear.
     
  6. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    No, staying here. I end up missing this place more.

    And it *is* a light leak. I think I found the problem. Going to take it with me on a walk this morning and test out my theory. The thing is...it's going to suck to have to retape the thing every time I go out with it...
     
  7. DBP

    DBP Member

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    Never seen a brick leak before. Where do you think it is coming in?
     
  8. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    Most likely where the door shuts in the back somewhere. I noticed that what light sealing it has is starting to go...so until I get that replaced it'll be a tape-up-all-exposed-corners kind of thing. :wink:
     
  9. Kino

    Kino Member

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    Hey, don't feel bad! Watch cinematographers take those beautiful, brand new Arriflex and Panavision motion picture cameras and slather their magazines on all seams with camera tape. They know what is important, the film and the images inside. Tape it up and be happy...
     
  10. Mike Kennedy

    Mike Kennedy Member

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    Hi Stephanie.
    You can peel the felt from film cassette ends and use that to cure your light leak until you invest in one of John Goodman's light seal kits.

    Mike
     
  11. colrehogan

    colrehogan Member

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    I'm curious about this too. I have never seen an Argus C3 leak. I have three of them.
     
  12. glennfromwy

    glennfromwy Member

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    I had one with a similar problem once. It turned out not to be a leak, but an internal reflection. Look in the chamber between the lens and film for missing flakes of the flat black paint. It doesn't stick that well to the bakelite and little spots can flake off, leaving shiny little places that can drive you mad. If the door is closing snugly, you should not have any leaks. What you have just doesn't look like a leak to me. Leaks tend to flare in from the side.
    Also, be aware that these lenses can flare pretty badly, though that's not what it looks like, either. Good luck. Bricks are fun!
     
  13. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    Doesn't look like that either. I'm going to take it out for yet another test run tomorrow and see if it was just something I did when developing the film. I DID open the back of the thing accidently and the door really isn't that tight...which is why I think it may either be a light leak or a weird effect from opening the door.

    But I've accidently opened the back of other cameras before and usually only lose one or two frames. This seems odd.
     
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  15. desertrat

    desertrat Member

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    That is really comforting information to know. Now I don't feel so sheepish when I tape up the magazine joint on my Kiev-80.
     
  16. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    This time I DIDN'T open the back and I still got the same thing...so it's a light leak. I'll post the images on my blog from the first frame to the last so that maybe we can get an idea of why the heck it's happening...because I have some frames that are fine (Shaded) and other frames that were horrible (I was shooting in full sun).
     
  17. DBP

    DBP Member

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    There aren't a lot of places an Argus can leak light, unless there is an actual hole somewhere. Try removing the lens and shining a light through an open shutter in a dark room. Then open the back and see if the shutter itself is leaking.
     
  18. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    Shutter is light tight. I'm thinking that it's leaking light from where the viewfinder and rangefinder windows are...but I don't know. I'll test that theory as soon as I can get some material for seals.
     
  19. DWThomas

    DWThomas Subscriber

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    Given the incredibly long market life of these C3s, I suppose there may be internal changes along the way, but . . .

    I have one I bought new around the end of 1957 (which just successfully worked for Argust 6th) and I just got it out to take a look. All of the following think-out-loud comments are based on my one sole example:

    a) There are NO light seals in mine. It has molded-in ribs and shapes that create a sort of labyrinth seal around the back.

    b) The hinge end is behind the film cassette, so I doubt that would be it, but are all the screws in the hinge?

    c) The viewfinder and rangefinder stuff appear totally isolated from the film chamber.

    d) I think (applied optics here) the spot is toward the lower left of the exposed frame as viewed from the rear of the camera.

    e) So I tried to assume the spotting might be occurring on the previous or next frame, not the one actually lined up for the exposure.

    f) If the frame is being hit prior to the exposure position, the light would have to hit between the right side of the masking frame (viewed from rear) and the sprocket shaft, a little below center. In the body, I only see one little plugged hole that's even a candidate, and it would be covered by the front plate. The other possibility would be the rivet that holds the pressure plate to the back at that area -- is it intact and tight? (Even that normally has the leatherette covering over the outside.) You might skip exposing a frame or two either side of a properly exposed frame, winding quickly through the unused frames (or in the dark). That might check for shutter leaks vs off-frame. Ideally, don't wind to, or take an exposure on, the last frame. If light is hitting next to the cassette, the last frame will have the spot anyway. If not, that end is clean.

    g) I really want to suspect something over near the catch end, but approximating where your spot would sit once the film is wound to the next frame, I think it would be past the latch section. I do note however, there are two rivets that hold the catch onto the body -- if the lower one of those were corroded away, that could be a candidate. There are three or four plugged holes toward the front of that film chamber, but again, all of those are covered by the front plate. (And possibly if whatever is in them falls out, the shutter stops working!)

    h) My other reservation about the take-up spool side is that the diameter would grow as you work your way through the roll and I would expect the spot to slowly move a bit laterally with each frame. From your three shots, that might be happening but two look pretty similar.

    Well, good luck -- that ends my forensic engineering for the night!

    DaveT
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 31, 2006
  20. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    I have ten frames from the beginning of the roll to where I stopped shooting that I've developed and scanned. I'll be able to show you what the leak looks like from beginning to end. It's weird...very, very weird.
     
  21. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    Okay: http://mentalexperimental.org/?p=30

    Posted in the order I took them on the roll. Not great photos, but I wasn't really worried about that. I think I'm going to have to tape the thing up so much no one is going to recognize it as a camera. :D
     
  22. JBrunner

    JBrunner Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Don't fix it. You may be able to ebay the shots for good money.
     
  23. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    "Aliens are speaking to me in these photographs. Can you decipher the message?"

    Billions!
     
  24. DBP

    DBP Member

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    I wouldn't buy any foam to seal it, as the brick never had foam seals. The only way I can think of a light leak getting in is if something is loose or cracked. Have you tried lighting the inside?
     
  25. DWThomas

    DWThomas Subscriber

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    If I was in your shoes at this point, I think I might take the camera into a darkroom and cut about a five inch piece of film off a roll. Lay the film across the normal film path with the left end tucked toward the front around the take-up spindle. Then let the camera sit in bright outdoor light for five or ten minutes. After that, go back to the darkroom, remove the film and develop it. By not moving the film at all while it's in the camera, you should be able to see where the light is coming from. You can get four or five test strips out of one 20 exp roll for multiple tests.

    A couple of your ten frames show apparently different effects, such as a streak or multiple "stepped" exposures. That's even stranger yet, but knowing exactly in what portion of the camera the light hits might provoke a eureka moment for the rest of the questions.

    Alternatively, following JBrunner's lead, if you could manipulate some light to get a shape resembling the "Blessed Virgin," you could flood *bay and retire. :D

    DaveT
     
  26. Iskra 2

    Iskra 2 Member

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    Sometimes the obvious is overlooked. Pick up another "Brick" and pitch the one you have. Regards. :D