Negative cleaning

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by philldresser, Aug 21, 2003.

  1. philldresser

    philldresser Subscriber

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    Anyone have recommendations for post development cleaning of negatives (mainly 35mm and 4x5).

    I live in an area which uses treated ground water which has a very high lime content, and so I use deionized water for final rinse but still get drying marks and what appears to be lime deposits. I use Hypo clearing agent prior to final wash but do not squeege for fear of scratching.

    I try to keep handling down to a minimum and I am not a lover of solvents but would use if necassary

    Phill
     
  2. Donald Miller

    Donald Miller Member

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    If you have lime (calcium and magnesium carbonate) deposits on your negatives, the best place to remove them is to prevent them from forming. That may mean using deionized water for your processing and wash, if conditions are that severe. Once they have formed and the negative is dry, chances of bringing the deposits back to a soluble state without the use of an acid are going to be pretty slim.
     
  3. inthedark

    inthedark Member

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    Phill,

    Instead of a squeegee, try a damp but wrung out sponge. Works great. OH, it needs to be one of the cello type sponges to not leave lint and don't use it for anything else.

    For the water issue, I suggest get one of the water filters for under the sink which removes "most particulate matter and hard deposits". I think they are about $20 for the contraption and about $8 for the filter and it works for about 3 months. Looks like a plastic jar with a filter, nothing fancy. Easy to install.
     
  4. Jorge Oliveira

    Jorge Oliveira Member

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    Another possibility is washing with deionized water.
    Ilfird recommends some like fill the tank, shake 10 times, empty, fill again, shake 20 times,...

    Anyone knows the details (it's in Ilford site somewhere).

    And, have you tried some Photoflo in the last wash?

    Jorge O
     
  5. bjorke

    bjorke Member

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    Brita!

    Filter all the water, all the time.

    If there are still occasional marks, I recommend PEC-12 and the little PECwipes very highly.
     
  6. Thilo Schmid

    Thilo Schmid Member

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    You may call me crazy, but I found out that spit works best to remove spotted lime residues on a neg. Of course, you'll have to re-clean it afterwards. I second the recommendation of PEC-12 and PEC Pads. If you suffer from lime coating all over the neg, you should consider distilled/demineralized water or something Drysonal for the final rinse.
     
  7. inthedark

    inthedark Member

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    I don't suffer from this problem, but nonetheless, what is PEC-12? Obviously a rinse of some sort, but is it purchased or made? Sorry, I haven't a clue.
     
  8. Reinhold

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    P**12 is high priced, re-packaged butyl acetate, sold in plastic bottles which cannot prevent the vapor pressure of the solvent from dissipating into thin air, thereby creating the need to buy summore before you've ever had a chance to use it all.

    Go down to the hardware store and buy a can of Weldwood Contact Adhesive Cleaner (butyl acetate), or if you're concerned about flamability, get a can of Energene Cleaning Fluid (a chlorinated hydrocarbon solvent). Either one will clean anything that is soluable in a *hydrocarbon fluid*, and do it very well without harming the photographic emulsion. It'll also last for years in that metal can.

    It's important to remember that hyrocarbon based solvents can only remove oils, marking pens, waxes, resins, tallows, and similar *hydrocarbon* based contaminants. They cannot remove mineral deposits. The only way to dissolve lime (calcium carbonate) is with an acid. A strong one at that. Not suggested.
     
  9. Reinhold

    Reinhold Subscriber

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    P**12 is high priced, re-packaged butyl acetate, sold in plastic bottles which cannot prevent the vapor pressure of the solvent from dissipating into thin air, thereby creating the need to buy summore before you've ever had a chance to use it all.

    Go down to the hardware store and buy a can of Weldwood Contact Adhesive Cleaner (butyl acetate), or if you're concerned about flamability, get a can of Energene Cleaning Fluid (a chlorinated hydrocarbon solvent). Either one will clean anything that is soluable in a *hydrocarbon fluid*, and do it very well without harming the photographic emulsion. It'll also last for years in that metal can.

    It's important to remember that hyrocarbon based solvents can only remove oils, marking pens, waxes, resins, tallows, and similar *hydrocarbon* based contaminants. They cannot remove mineral deposits. The only way to dissolve lime (calcium carbonate) is with an acid. A strong one at that. Not suggested.
     
  10. Reinhold

    Reinhold Subscriber

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    Sorry for the double post, my finger must have had the hiccups...
     
  11. ann

    ann Subscriber

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    We have been using Edwal"s wetting agent for about a year with no sludge marks. Film is washed with tap water. Wetting agent is used with distilled water. Agitate for about 30 seconds, hang to dry. No problems with water spots.
     
  12. Ed Sukach

    Ed Sukach Member

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    I too, have been using Edwal's "LFN" for ten years or so, as a response to *terrible* troubles with Kodak's Photo Flow.

    Usurous price for a tiny bottle ... that lasts for four or five years, a drop at a time.

    Good stuff!!
     
  13. philldresser

    philldresser Subscriber

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    Just a little feedback to all the posters on this thread. I purchased a sponge specifically for the job and used deionised water and my last batch were much cleaner. Still not perfect but noticable better. The 4x5 negs were 1000% better.

    Thanks

    Phill
     
  14. Jorge Oliveira

    Jorge Oliveira Member

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    Just a note re Edwal LFN:
    I've seen somewhere that it was pure alcohol+some type of detergent.

    If one wants to try:

    25cc pure alcohol
    2.5cc PhotoFlo

    Water for 1L.

    I use this mix.

    Jorge O