No images

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by ty sonoma, Aug 3, 2009.

  1. ty sonoma

    ty sonoma Member

    Messages:
    5
    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2008
    Shooter:
    35mm RF
    Aside from a boneheaded mistake like leaving the cover of your rangefinder lens on, would the use of a marginal developer (D-76, cooked up 10 months ago) cause the entire of strip of film to be wiped out?

    I had a roll of Tri-X that I tried to develop in D-76 (1:1, 8 minutes at 20 C) and all the frames came up blank.

    This is not the first time I've tried to develop film although this was the first time I only went 8 minute.

    Any clues to pass along? By the way, I had a second roll in the same developer tank and that roll had 80% of the images come out.

    Thanks!
     
  2. keithwms

    keithwms Member

    Messages:
    6,070
    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2006
    Location:
    Charlottesvi
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    You should have gotten something if you also got some images on another roll. Developers don't exhaust spontaneously! Sounds like an exposure issue or lens cap. What kind of camera is this? Have you tested the shutter?
     
  3. Morry Katz

    Morry Katz Member

    Messages:
    133
    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2008
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Did the film actually go through the camera ?
    Morry Katz
     
  4. Sirius Glass

    Sirius Glass Subscriber

    Messages:
    20,714
    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2007
    Location:
    Southern California
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Welcome to a distinguished group of experienced boneheads! You will fit right in with some of us!

    Steve
     
  5. wogster

    wogster Member

    Messages:
    1,267
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Location:
    Bruce Penins
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Have a look at the rebate, this is the section of film outside the sprocket holes (in 35mm or along the very edge of other roll film sizes) it often contains identifying marks like film type and speed, frame number, etc. If the rebate is easily read, then I would suspect that it's a camera problem. If the rebate is blank, then it depends on the position of the reel with that film in the tank, if it's was at the bottom of a 2 reel tank then I would suspect the developer, if at the top then I would ask if there was enough developer in the tank to start with.

    Another concern is the other roll, only 80% of the images turned out, were the missing 20% at one end, or dispersed within the roll, were they blank or just faint. If they were blank and interspersed then again, I would suspect the camera either not feeding properly or not firing properly.

    Your time is too short, according to the tech sheet for D76, Tri-X in a small tank (any tank that holds less then 5 reels is a small tank) at 20℃ 1:1 should be about 10 minutes. If your developer is 10 months old, then it could be marginal, and that combined with the short time, resulted in a dud.
     
  6. DLawson

    DLawson Member

    Messages:
    321
    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Location:
    Dayton, Ohio
    Shooter:
    35mm
    If you make the second roll the first roll, it reminds me of a bonehead mistake when I was a HS yearbook photographer, shooting the homecoming court. Shooting 35mm SLR with flash, I got to the end of the roll. So I quickly held the camera by the lens, rewound, reloaded and started shooting. What I didn't notice was that when I held the lens, I twisted the aperture ring.

    The film wasn't *quite* blank, but close enough.
     
  7. archphoto

    archphoto Member

    Messages:
    1,066
    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2008
    Location:
    Holland and
    Shooter:
    4x5 Format
    Less than a bonehaed but more a camera-lens failure: one tiny loose srew in the aperture mechanism of my Rollei SL66 80mm lens caused heavy underexposure: the photo's were useless.

    With 35mm allway's check the rewind knob when winding onto the next frame, esp in the beginning of the roll.
    It is allways possible that the film became loose when closing the back.
    Don't try to get 38 exposures out of a rol of 36....

    Some early camera's, like my Regula P, had a safe-guard build into it: no film-advance no next shutter release.

    Peter
     
  8. 2F/2F

    2F/2F Member

    Messages:
    8,003
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Location:
    Los Angeles,
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    The one time a film has been totally blank for me, it was because it did not go through the camera. I was new to photography, and was my first time using a new camera (Minolta X-700) that had been given to me and with which I was unfamiliar. I was used to the Canon QL loading.

    Even with old developer, there should be a faint trace of pictures, if they were exposed onto the film in the first place.

    In either case, you should still have edge markings of some sort.

    If there are no edge markings, the film was not developed; it was fixed first.
     
  9. JBrunner

    JBrunner Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    7,077
    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2005
    Location:
    Basin and Range Province
    Shooter:
    8x10 Format
    If the developer was inactive, the film would appear totally blank. (ie. fixed first because it didn't get developed so your developer is the suspect, or you accidentally fixed instead of developed) If you have edge markings, the film wasn't exposed (your camera or yourself is the suspect)

    You can test developer by placing a snip of totally exposed (completely flashed) film in it in. The film should turn black after a few minutes.
     
  10. 2F/2F

    2F/2F Member

    Messages:
    8,003
    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Location:
    Los Angeles,
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    If the developer was totally inactive, then yes, this could happen, and there would be no edge markings. If the developer was left in an open container for those ten months, it would do nothing at all. However, even if it was in a half-full bottle, it should still do something after ten months.
     
  11. ntenny

    ntenny Member

    Messages:
    2,282
    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2008
    Location:
    San Diego, C
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Of course, if the other roll in the same tank showed any images at all, it can't be a "fixer went in first" problem. On the other hand, it seems strange that developer at the point of failure would develop most of one roll and *nothing* on the other. From the available information, I'd guess that the blank roll was never exposed.

    It would be helpful to know if the edge markings came out, though.

    -NT
     
  12. JBrunner

    JBrunner Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    7,077
    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2005
    Location:
    Basin and Range Province
    Shooter:
    8x10 Format
    Good point. Makes me think perhaps developer volume could be a suspect as well...
     
  13. cmacd123

    cmacd123 Member

    Messages:
    1,495
    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Location:
    Stittsville, Ontario
    Shooter:
    35mm
    There is generaly some of the leader left on a roll of 35mm film when the tank is loaded. That should be uniformly BLACK. and as mentioned the edge print is a good check point. if all three are blank you have developer failure. if the edge print and the black part of the leader is there you have camera or exposure problems.
     
  14. ty sonoma

    ty sonoma Member

    Messages:
    5
    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2008
    Shooter:
    35mm RF
    Wow...this is quite an outpouring of helpful hints and comments. Thanks!!

    After careful review, I have to grudgingly acknowledge that it was a bonehead mistake. The camera in question is a Leica M3 that gave me problems when I was learning how to load film. I thought I had worked out the kinks...making sure that the arrow on the rewind nob showed the film being advanced. I guess I reverted to my old, dumb habit of thinking the roll was spooled correctly when it was not. The second roll (at the bottom of my two reel tank) came out OK save for 4 exposures.

    I am going to brew a fresh developer (X-Tol) and try again with a few more rolls I have waiting to be developed.

    Thanks again to everyone offering their thoughts and comments.

    ...I am thinking I like it here. :cool:

    Cheers!