Oriental Paper

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Grillage, May 12, 2013.

  1. Grillage

    Grillage Member

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    Hi! I am hoping someone can help me on this. I am working on a very important project. For many years I have used exclusively Oriental VC double weight fiber based paper. (Developed in Dektol) For some time I have noticed surface mottling. Is seems like minute rigges that have no real pattern that are in one direction on the paper. On much older Oriental papers this is not present. It has millions of tiny holes or "dots" on the surface but at least it is relatively smooth. I see this pattern most often in clear skies in my images. I am purchasing some Ilford paper of the similar type and see what results I get from this paper. Does anyone have experience with both papers, this problem and which paper do YOU feel gives superior results? I have heard Ilford is slightly warmer then most but I will use selenium toner as necessary to give the "tone" I require for my work. Thank you everyone!!! Dave
     
  2. jeffreyg

    jeffreyg Subscriber

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    Quite sometime ago I used Oriental Seagull graded papers that were always reliable. When they went out of business at that time I switched to Ilford. I have been using Ilford Multigrade FB paper for a number of years and have never had a problem nor with the ir MGFB warm tone. I find the warm tone to be slightly more contrasty. I was using Zone VI paper developer until it was no longer available and now use Dektol. I do selenium tone but not to make a very noticeable change. I remove from the toner as soon as I see a very slight change in the mid tones. Of course everyone has different tastes so you may have to try different developers or toning times to get the result you are seeking.

    http://www.jeffreyglasser.com/
     
  3. chip j

    chip j Subscriber

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    Maybe it's the film?
     
  4. sepiareverb

    sepiareverb Subscriber

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    I use both papers regularly and have not seen this problem. I did have a box of 1620 Seagull VC fiber that had thin spots in the paper base, only visible when the paper was wet and swollen. I contacted them and was told it was paper from the very end of the roll that could exhibit this.
     
  5. Alan Ross

    Alan Ross Member

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    I just had someone else write me today about mottle/surface issues with the current Oriental paper, so there must be something going on. I'l see if I can find out anything.

    In the meantime, I have been using nothing but the Ilford MGFB for printing the Ansel Adams Special Edition prints for nearly thirty years and have always found it up to the task. I experiment with other papers for my own work from time to time, and the last time I used Oriental (a couple of years ago) it was very good.

    I have found the Ilford to be the most consistent paper I have used over the years. You can experiment with some different developers to see if you find any color shifts. You certainly can't go wrong with Dektol as far as image quality.

    Good luck!


    www.alanrossphotography.com
     
  6. Grillage

    Grillage Member

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    Thank you everyone! I do have a slight mottling problem with the film but is the processing. I use T-Max 400 for everything from 35 mm to 8x10 I use a JOBO CPP2 processor and T-Max RS Developer. The streaks or mottling are inline with the drum rotation. I will have to experment with the processing to find the problem.
     
  7. Alan Ross

    Alan Ross Member

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    I checked with Eric Joseph at Freestyle Photo in Hollywood about the issue:

    "Haven't heard anything regarding defects in Oriental paper. It has changed over the years as Oriental no longer makes their own paper and hasn't for a long time.
    We don't sell much of it anymore either. Did the customer get it from us?"

    Eric is VERY plugged in to what is going on in the industry - so you may have something else going on...
     
  8. Roger Cole

    Roger Cole Member

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    Who does make Oriental paper now?
     
  9. R.Gould

    R.Gould Member

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    At one time it was made for oriental by Harman, I believe, and could still be as Harman do coat for other people,
     
  10. michael_r

    michael_r Subscriber

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    I actually heard the same thing from a credible source. This was in 2008. I was using quite a bit of Oriental VC-FB at the time. Never had a problem with it.
     
  11. kintatsu

    kintatsu Member

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    My understanding from their website was that they make their own in Japan. They have quite a line up, given the times, so who knows what's made where and by whom.
     
  12. Grillage

    Grillage Member

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    I just bought a small box of Ilford MG fiber based paper and I will print some negatives that seem to have the mottling. I will let everyone know the results.
     
  13. LJSLATER

    LJSLATER Member

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    I've not noticed any trouble with my glossy Oriental VC FB II. I use Polymax T. Did your bad paper all come from the same pack?
     
  14. Grillage

    Grillage Member

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    Yes, from many boxes.
     
  15. Grillage

    Grillage Member

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    Just to UPDATE this blog. I recently printed an image that did show mottling on Oriental paper and I used Ilford VC Fiber Based paper. BINGO! The mottling is gone!!! The Ilford paper is not as cold and does not have the same gloss but its so nice to have a clean look to the sky without any artifacts.