parodinal as a print developer

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by marcsv, Sep 17, 2006.

  1. marcsv

    marcsv Member

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    Has anyone else tried this?

    I tried it yesterday. I used the parodinal version that doesn't use potassium bromide. It gave out nicely toned prints on generic paper. I used 1:20 dilution and my usual water bath.
     
  2. Jerevan

    Jerevan Subscriber

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  3. juan

    juan Subscriber

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    I"ve thought about this. I did develop Azo a few times in Rodinal 1:20.
    juan
     
  4. marcsv

    marcsv Member

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    I really liked the final prints i got from this brew...I'm seriously thinking of using this as my primary print developer rather than D76. The prints I made had a warm brownish tone, I cant wait to try this with split - grade printing.
     
  5. ZorkiKat

    ZorkiKat Member

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    You use D76 for paper?

    paRodinal should work with paper. I used old sheets of bromide paper to test paRodinal (if it indeed was able to develop) when I was first brewing it. The paper blackened- solid black- almost as soon as it hit the concentrated solution.

    Since paRodinal is just like real rodinal, the comments from the ORWO FORMULAE book could apply- and here is a quote:

    "R 09 can be used even for developing photographic paper. In doing so, suitable papers show a warm tone.

    Ratio of diluting : Contrast

    1+5 to 1+10 : Normal
    1+20 : Soft
    1+30 to 1+40: Extra Soft (especially for two-bath developing)

    Attention! durability and utilization of highly diluted R 09 developer are less than those of special paper developers."

    Some papers, notably those marked 'rapid' RC types have hydroquinone or some other developing agent incorporated in their emulsions. As such they often need only a strong alkaline bath to start developing. These paper often show a rather warm tone when subjected to such alkaline activator baths.

    Jay
     
  6. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    Since I'm thinking of picking up a bunch of Rodinal here shortly just in case (yeah, I know it's around, but I don't want it getting hard to find on me) I thought about experimenting with something like this after I had some experience with printing. I've heard of the really nice results, but I haven't really seen them. Anyone have some print scans that would give me an idea of how they look?
     
  7. Jerevan

    Jerevan Subscriber

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    Yeah, I second that, let's see prints if someone has something they want to show.

    EDIT: If that doesn't happen, I'll have to get around to do some myself and post. But that'll take a few days or a week...
     
  8. marcsv

    marcsv Member

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    print sample using parodinal ans print developer

    as requested

    jay: sorry 'bout that, I meant to write dektol not D76
    here's one of the first prints, i'll post more in a few days
    Image sample
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 18, 2006
  9. gainer

    gainer Subscriber

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    Another consideration. p-aminophenol, the agent of either Rodinal or Parodinal, is synergistic with either hydroquinone or sodium ascorbate. 4 grams (1 teaspoon) of ascorbate in a liter of 1+50 Rodinal is about as active as 1+25 Rodinal. If you use hydroquinone, control the color of the print by adding more or less sulfite.
     
  10. marcsv

    marcsv Member

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    Actually the next stage would be adding hydroquinone. The soup i used didn't use potassium bromide, I'm thniking of using by newest batch whech has about a gram of potassium bromide for every 250 ml. how would this affect the print?
     
  11. Gene_Laughter

    Gene_Laughter Member

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    I have used Rodinal at dilutions of 1 to 20 and even 1 to 30 for print developing for bromoil matrices.

    Gene
     
  12. marcsv

    marcsv Member

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  13. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    They're looking very low contrast to me.
     
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  15. Jerevan

    Jerevan Subscriber

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    The potassium bromide would work as a restrainer (correct me if I am wrong), while the sodium ascorbate/hydroquinone would make it work, as said earlier, with greater strength.

    The prints look nice with a good tone, though it looks like they lack a bit in contrast (so hard to judge from a scan, onscreen!), it works well with the subject matter.
     
  16. marcsv

    marcsv Member

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    hmm maybe I should try split-grade printing for my next batch, but i have to get m' hands on some VC paper first.
     
  17. marcsv

    marcsv Member

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    I found a recipe indicating that potassium bromide lowers film fog, I'm just not quite sure how this would translate to enlarging paper, thanks for the hydroquinine tip.
     
  18. gainer

    gainer Subscriber

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    Bromide works with paper as it does with film, but, but changes print color sometimes. It varies more or at least as much from developer to developer as from paper to paper to film etc. It's a matter of different strokes for different folks. Sometimes benzotriazole is called for. Most of us, I think, keep a saturated solution of KBr around so we can add a drop or two as the spirit moves.
     
  19. gainer

    gainer Subscriber

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    There I go, but butting in againgain.
     
  20. marcsv

    marcsv Member

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    KBr and print tone

    I read form The Compact Photo Lab Index (Morgan and Morgan, 1977) that adding more KBr to a developer, like Ansco/Agfa for example, gives the print a warmer tone. I wonder if it does the same for my version of PAP HCl. Also I mixed a new batch of PAP HCl, this time I included about 2.5 grams of Hydroquinone. Actually its starting to look like to Kodak's D-8 (which I understand, gives more contrast).

    Only one way to find out...more film and darkroom tests.
     
  21. haziz

    haziz Subscriber

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    The question is: Why?

    Commercial paper developers are dirt cheap and have so far, at least for me, been easily available.

    Sincerely,

    Hany.
     
  22. gainer

    gainer Subscriber

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    Why? Because it's there, and because the commercial ones may not always be there. If I have to order and pay shipping from a place 500 miles away to get something that is made from ingredients I can buy at the country store, I'll learn how to make it myself. If the same concoction that works on film also works on prints, so much the better.

    When I wrote the article "Non-chromogenic Antiscorbutic Developers for Black and White", which can still be viewed on www.unblinkingeye.com, there was one component, metol, that I could not get at small town grocery or hardware stores. P-aminophenol would have served, but I did not think of getting it from acetaminophen.
     
  23. marcsv

    marcsv Member

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    To me its having more creative control over the photographic process than economics. I've been exclusively using one set of developer for years (d76 for film and dektol for prints).I dont have problems locating merchants for them, but there comes a point where you have to expand your skillset.
     
  24. marcsv

    marcsv Member

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    I tried my 2 new batches, one has twice the original amount of potassium bromide, the other had a gram of hdroquinone. will post the results as when i scan the prints
     
  25. Stephanie Brim

    Stephanie Brim Member

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    YAY! I've been watching this with interest. If it works well, I may start making parodinal to use as a print developer.

    Out of curiosity, what times are you using?
     
  26. Lachlan Young

    Lachlan Young Member

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    I seem to remember reading that Calbe Photochemie used to reccomend dilutions of 1+5 to 1+20 for paper development - just remember that 1+20 dilution will require 5 minutes or so of development to gain enough contrast.

    Hope this helps,

    Lachlan