People Preferring Analog

Discussion in 'Industry News' started by Colin Corneau, Feb 28, 2012.

  1. Colin Corneau

    Colin Corneau Subscriber

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  2. vpwphoto

    vpwphoto Member

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    :smile:
     
  3. bsdunek

    bsdunek Subscriber

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    Guess I fit in there too. I use the latest technology at work, but like film and my darkroom.
     
  4. Toffle

    Toffle Member

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    Very well put; an article which states the value of one experience without denigrating the other.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 28, 2012
  5. keithwms

    keithwms Member

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    Very nice!
     
  6. CGW

    CGW Member

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    Been there, done that, got the hand-screened organic cotton, cruelty-free t-shirt. There's always more than a whiff of latent hipsterism covered in these articles which are almost plentiful enough to claim their own genre. Reader reaction swings between "That's what I do, " to "You're kidding, right?" Loathe playing vinyl and shooting film being regarded as retro fashion statements rather than preferences untouched by aspirational advertising. Off to buy some film and cassettes.
     
  7. fotch

    fotch Member

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    At one time photography was the new technology.
     
  8. Diapositivo

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    Vinyl is technically inferior to CDs.
    Film is technically superior to digital (highlights rendering, dynamic range).

    What would suit this forum more would be a comparison between a CD (or lower-end digital compression formats) and high-end audiotapes (not cassettes) recorded and played at relatively high speed with dbx. That can certainly compete, and maybe even surpass, CDs.

    When I use digital in photography, I do it because it is convenient.
    When I use analogue in photography, I do it because it is superior.

    An audio cassette or a vinyl record are good for nostalgia feelings. They are technically inferior, no doubt. Musical digital recording is both more convenient and of better quality.

    If there was a digital camera capable of giving me the same quality of film with the same kind of investment, I would have gone 100% digital without any regret.

    Film is with us because it is actually better.

    Fabrizio
     
  9. Aristophanes

    Aristophanes Member

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    The analog irony is that the referenced equipment is all of industrial design and manufacture requiring a mass market to consume.

    It's easy to have an alternative when someone else originally paid for the product's existence in the first place.
     
  10. Colin Corneau

    Colin Corneau Subscriber

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    That may be true, Aristophanes, but it's second-guessing the past...what's happened has happened, so it's only practical to utilize the tools available.

    I feel incredibly fortunate to have a variety of tools, for whatever the task at hand is -- because having options gives you and I more control, creatively and otherwise. This is a good thing.
     
  11. clayne

    clayne Member

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    What's your deal man? Every single thread on this forum you've got an axe to grind. Try all you want to "educate" - it'll just result in alienation.

    For the record, and back to the thread itself, reel to reel is technically superior to CDs. It's also more musical and is the more accurate analog of film.
     
  12. MDR

    MDR Member

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    Both Vinyl and Tape have more dynamic range than CD and a lot more dynamic range than mp3. Digital is just cheaper and the sound is clearer because it lacks a lot of tones/frequencies and therefore produce a sharper cleaner sound. It's the same thing with digital photography because it has less dynamic range it looks cleaner and sharper while in fact it has a lot less information.

    Dominik
     
  13. benjiboy

    benjiboy Subscriber

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    The reason received wisdom is that CD is superior to Vinyl is because most people have only heard Vinyl played on relatively inexpensive equipment, I can assure you that Vinyl played on high end audiophile quality equipment sounds better, but at a much greater cost.
     
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  15. Steve Smith

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    Only up to a point. That point being when the quality of the vinyl reproduction equipment exceeds the quality of the equipment the music was recorded on.

    There are some fantastic albums from the 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s which were recorded on equipment which many audiophiles would consider hopelessly inferior to anything they would consider owning.


    Steve.
     
  16. Arkasha

    Arkasha Member

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    er, no, it's not. Not by any means.

    One is certainly more convenient than the other, and more portable. But vinyl definitely outputs better sound.
     
  17. Arkasha

    Arkasha Member

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    This is quite true. One the most famous recordings ever, Miles Davis' "Kind of Blue," has a fairly nasty tape hiss throughout.
     
  18. CGW

    CGW Member

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    Amen. Even something like the very affordable Rega RP1 or RP3 makes a huge difference over a tired 70s table, worn-out cartridge/stylus, and faulty memories.
     
  19. CGW

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    OK, like what? Revox tape decks? Mercury Living Presence 35mm tape recordings? early 60s analog DG classical recordings? RCA Shaded Dog classical titles?
     
  20. CGW

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    Looks like the village explainers and fabulists are at it again...
     
  21. Thomas Bertilsson

    Thomas Bertilsson Subscriber

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    Great fun article, Colin.
    I love it when people can think outside the norm and embrace something just because they like it. Why be like everybody else?
     
  22. CGW

    CGW Member

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    Rampant mass individualism?
     
  23. Thomas Bertilsson

    Thomas Bertilsson Subscriber

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    No.
     
  24. CGW

    CGW Member

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    Rampant mass individualism?

    Meant as a joke.
     
  25. Aristophanes

    Aristophanes Member

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    They are NOT thinking outside the norm!

    They are simply using what was the norm 30 years ago under the guise of being different.

    Do YOU remember the rooms full of manual typewriters hammering away? The secretarial pools? The "auditory experience" was terrible.

    Those were the norm and, frankly, they were awful.

    It's a quirky article but is romanticizes and makes nostalgic processes that were dreary back then. Writers used to justify their romance with the typewriter even though the hated the damn things and saw them as a necessary evil.

    The economics of this is 100% funded by the fact that the equipment is dirt cheap salvage which consumers, businesses and government now find inefficient to use. Using Super 8 for example, is staggeringly more expensive than other mediums and it is ONLY made possible by the cost differential. The funds to process are only there because of the rock-bottom salvage costs of the cameras. This is why it is artists using disposable income are the ones gravitating to older technology. They are using the detritus of past economic and technological cycles can calling it an expressive medium whereas once it was blood and guts, money-making enterprise. Let's not put on rose coloured glasses. If she makes a terrific film, excellent. That's what counts. Making the process itself an artistic statement is a personal choice, one made possible by prior economic subsidy.

    And this quote from the article makes me laugh:

    "In a sense, the digital world can only deal with things that can be quantified, says Milne, 38, who has an engineering background. "So things like experience, even spirituality and religion -- all that stuff that we can't push into a rational, logical framework, sort of drops off the map."

    You have got to be kidding me.

    When personal computers came out they were seen as a means of humanizing ("Hello. Welcome to Macintosh") what for most was a deeply dehumanizing experience, and that was white collar analog information management. People went blind loading fonts into prepress machines. Hard hammering typewriters contributed to deafness. Computers were seen as liberating. Less so in hindsight, but that takes nothing away from the sheer drudgery beforehand.

    And an engineer should know that analog is just as much about quantification as digital.

    I have no problem with using analog devices in "new and creative ways", but to assert nonsense about some sort of spiritual connection is absurd. It was never that way in the past. In fact, corporate managers were the ones who tried to "liberate" the workplace in such ways against the average person who used the equipment. The guy in the corner suite dictated to a typist.

    It's like people romanticizing haystacks but they would never get in a field themselves and pitchfork one into being to foster a greater connection to the land. It's always better when someone else, preferably in another country or our hard working farming ancestors, had to do the really hard work.

    These hipsters have not only short memories, but they are creating their own media-infused ones that are fundamentally inaccurate compared to the historical record. There's also no shortage of lo-fi elitism. Instead of just appreciating the image, we get this:

    "With film, "there's a lot more communication between photographer and subject," he says. "I find it can be more of a collaboration."

    Prove it by looking at the image. Prove it. Because the next day, no one will be able to tell. Nor will they in 10 or 100 years. Therefore it's not about the art, it's about the artist's self-justification. Each to their own, but at least have the courage to call it what it is.
     
  26. jp498

    jp498 Member

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    Of course. In this situation, he's learning about the reporter and testing their boundaries of guilability and understanding and seeing if the reporter is at all rational or logical. Some reporters can smell the BS, others more "right brain" reporters suck this stuff right up. I'm in the tech business and have been interviewed frequently for local newspaper articles about technology and engineering matters. It's useful to determine how well the reporter understands things, whether they are left or right brain for example, as you have to choose your words so they can interpret their news source right. Some rare and harmless and obscure BS'ing will also determine how well the reporter checks facts. Doesn't have to be done every story; just once usually.

    The original "renaissance men" had a logical framework for religion right along with their science; easy for them, but their respective theocracies wouldn't buy into the science part of them so quickly. Back then, people would die from misunderstandings. Now, if your reporter doesn't understand the framework, you just get a crappy article.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 29, 2012