POP Paper

Discussion in 'Alternative Processes' started by Rlibersky, Apr 15, 2008.

  1. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

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    I came across 100 sheets of Kodak ARISTO paper ~1970. The box was unopened but did not have any instructions with it. I assumed it was DOP but learned yesterday this is POP. Any information on this paper would be appreciated

    I have not used POP before. I know it can be exposed by the sun, but what is the iso of the paper? Can an artificial light expose it? How is it processed once it is exposed? I know it isn't processed in a Developer but it must be fixed, toned and made permanent some how.

    Lots of questions, hoping for answers.

    Thanks
    Randy
     
  2. Ole

    Ole Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    POP is exposed by ultraviolet light, of which sunlight is a good source. Artificial light can also expose it, but it needs either a very high UV content, or exeedingly long exposure times.

    After exposure wash well, and fix in weak "plain hypo". Gold toning is usually carried out before fixing, but the end result is just about the same if the toning is done after instead.

    Selenium toning is possible, but I won't recommend it since it also bleaches the image. Some have reported very good results with extremely dilute KRST, but all I've ever managed is mush. ;

    BTW, I'm moving this thread to "Alternative processes", where the chance of relevant answers is much better.
     
  3. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

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    Thanks, I'll give it a try tonight.
     
  4. Michael Kadillak

    Michael Kadillak Member

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    POP

    Google "Centennial POP"

    It will take you to a web site with complete instructions and visual samples.

    Cheers!
     
  5. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

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    I put a piece in the sun with a negative on top. It was late so the sun was low in the sky say 15-20 degrees in Minnesota. Processed it in a borax/gold chloride solution, as shown in the "Centennial POP" instructions, and got a print that was light. The part of the print that was outside the negative was a dark reddish brown but the picture part was say 2 stops lighter.

    Should I wait and work on this in the middle of the day when the sun is high? How long of an exposure should I start with on this paper?
     
  6. Ole

    Ole Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    That's why contact printing frames had hinged backs: Expose until done, then tone and fix. :wink:

    At my latitude (60° N) about 10 minutes is about right - in summer. I increase to 20 minutes, then move indoors as the light disappears for the winter.
     
  7. keeds

    keeds Member

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    Not sure about Sun exposure, but mine times for a 4 tube sun lamp is 8mins at 20cm...
     
  8. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

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    Ole, is that in the middle of the day when the sun is highest? I'm at 45° N. I work on it more this weekend when i can get at it around noon.

    I do have a hinged frame and thought the picture looked dark enough. It bleached a little bit when toning.
     
  9. smieglitz

    smieglitz Subscriber

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    If it is a regular POP paper it will start to "bronze" in the print shadow areas and the area surrounding the negative when exposure is correct (assuming you have a negative of sufficient density range). The bronzing looks a bit metallic and the slight greenish color will contrast with the reddish portions of the image that have received less exposure.

    Joe
     
  10. Guillaume Zuili

    Guillaume Zuili Subscriber

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    Don't be afraid to overexpose the print. It really need a lot.
    Gold and hypo will bleach the print.
    Add to that pronounced dry down...
    -)

    Guillaume
     
  11. Ole

    Ole Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Joe and Guilliaume are correct (as always): It takes a lot of exposure, and it will look overexposed when it's right. I use Tetenal gold toner, which doesn't seem to bleach as much as some other toners. Also I feel that the "bleaching" in the fix is not so much a bleaching as a colour change, where the lighter (browner) tone during fixing looks like a bleaching action.

    When that is said, I use extremely dilute rapid fixer to bleach the highlights back if they seem veiled - 1:40 or so instead of the 1:4 you would use for "normal" prints.

    POP is a great process, capable of stunning results with a tonal scale which just cannot be compared to any modern paper or process. Ideally the negative should have extreme contrast, but the contrast in the print can be adjusted by exposing in direct sun and/or partial shade. "Northlight" gives higher print contrast from a given negative, which is useful for any kind of normal negative. Of course that means that the exposure time will be hours or days instead of minutes, so it's a good idea to start with very contrasty negatives in direct sunligh.
     
  12. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

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    Wow, Guess I'll cut a sheet down and start small, 2-1/4 instead of 5x7. the print was nowhere near what is being said. I've seen a few POP prints and think it it will be worth figuring out. Thanks for your help.
     
  13. Guillaume Zuili

    Guillaume Zuili Subscriber

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    It's easy and cool !
    Just seat close to your printing frame in the garden, to keep away cats or whatever else coming too close...
    Have a book, a drink, and look from time to time -)
    And resist the temptation to pull out the print, waiting is 3/4 of pleasure...
    G.
     
  14. Dana Sullivan

    Dana Sullivan Advertiser Advertiser

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    On a side note, we got an e-mail from Albumen Works saying that they had come to an agreement with Harman to continue production of the Centennial POP. The cutting order for the last batch produced by Kentmere is going in shortly. I will be receiving 20-40 boxes of 8x10 from this batch, so it would be wise to call and get on the waiting list for some of it.
     
  15. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

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    So I had an opportunity to try out this paper this week end. In other words the sun finally came out on Sunday.

    The exposure was still long at least 30 minutes for each of the 6 negatives I tried. I used various levels of contrast for testing. The negs with more contrast did look better.

    The exposed print had a deep purple color in the shadow areas, lighter purple in the highlights. When I washed the print before toning There was no milky residue that the books talked about. I put it in the print into the Borax/gold toner it changed to a rust, almost orange color.

    After toning I put the first few print into a regular fixing bath. The prints bleached to nothing very quickly. I then read a little more found a formula using 40grams of hypo to 1 liter of water. This slowed the bleaching down but not enough. Made a new batch 20grams Hypo to 1 liter water. There was some bleaching but not much. The print still was the bright rust color. After dring the print is a nice brown color. I will try to get a scan of it soon.

    All in all not a bad test. Took me about 10 sheets to get a good print. The paper is nice has almost a leather look to it texture.

    My questions
    Is the Fixer strong enough to be complete? Are there other fixes that will not bleach the print?
    Am I correct in assuming that different toners will give me a different color?
     
  16. Ole

    Ole Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    I have only used Tetenal gold toner, which progresses through red-brown to blueish-black as toning progresses. As your print bleached in the fixer, it can't have been completely toned. Try longer toning next time?

    I do the first bit of washing in a tray with relatively little water, and pour the milky solution in with my spent fixer for eventual silver reclamation. Sometimes there's hardly any milkyness, other times there's a lot. It depends on the chloride content of the water, among other things.
     
  17. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

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    How long should I tone for? Just a best guess would be fine. I toned for about 5 minutes.
     
  18. keeds

    keeds Member

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    I tone in Tetenal Gold Toner for between 1 to 2 minutes.
     
  19. Guillaume Zuili

    Guillaume Zuili Subscriber

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    I clear the print in 5 or 6 different water fill.
    I tone between 10 to 15 minutes (Gold toner from B&S). The more you tone the colder it turns.
    Platinum or paladium toning is beautiful too.
    I fix 10 minutes in two sodium thiosulfate bath (5 minutes each). Regular fix will kill the print.
    Then Hypo and wash (30minutes)
     
  20. Guillaume Zuili

    Guillaume Zuili Subscriber

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    Toning protects the print against bleach during fix.
    So, less toning more pronounced bleach and more toning less bleach in fix.
     
  21. Ray Rogers

    Ray Rogers Member

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    Arrival of Answers for a Rival

    Perhaps you have been misled?

    The paper you have is most likely a contact speed DOP.
    It could be a fine grain-smooth G surface or possibly a Y "silk" texture...
    the difference would be immeadiately obvious.

    Expose and dev 2 min in D-52/selectol at 20 C. and let me know how it goes.

    Ray

    PS
    If you would like to send me a few sample sheets, and get some more info on this paper as well, please PM me.

     
  22. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

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    Thanks Ray, I will send you a message. I origanlly tried printing it as DOP paper and the best I were mushy prints.

    Even in direct sun it takes 25-35 mins to turn a dark purple. My negs were developed for enlarging so they aren't bullet proof.