Problem with Rollei SuperPan 200 BW film...What the heck ???

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Raphael, Dec 7, 2011.

  1. Raphael

    Raphael Subscriber

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    Hi all,

    I read with great interest the other threads about Foma quality problems in 120 !

    I found something very worrying with a 120 roll of SuperPan 200 from Rollei I just bought for testing.
    You can see in attachment a scan of a "zone of interest" from the film, freshly processed this week.

    Obviously, there is a "transfer" from the ink of backing paper onto film !!! You can see the numbers of backing paper (in reverse, upside-down), and alignement square dots as ghosts images ! Worse, the whole zone of highlight is motled, likes something in the backing paper get sticky to film.

    Actually, I have already see these kind of quirks with a bundle of ten Fomapan 200 in 120, several years ago. I thought then that something get wrong because of my storing condition, as it happens only with the last rolls of batch, more than a year after buying it.

    In this case, for the Rollei Superpan 200, I bought it only a few month ago, and it was always stored in his original thight container, in a rather cool place (lower than 17/18°C). All the other B&W and even color film I store in the same place are Ok, including all the Fomapan rolls I bought since the "defective" batch.

    So, what do you think of this ? Storing problem (or other (?)) ? Rare "Bad lemon" Or defective production ?

    In the last case, I will be rather disappointed by this first experience with Superpan, I am usually confident with Rollei brandname for film until now.


    Regards,

    Raphael
     

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  2. Mustafa Umut Sarac

    Mustafa Umut Sarac Member

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    Its another reason not to play game on these expensive films. I met too many people who had Rollei 35 cameras with all the mechanical disfunctions a camera has to have. I paid my camera 120 dollars and it is impossible to respool the finished film , its not possible to take more than 10 normal pictures per 36. I used 80 years old Leicas and never got a problem.
    I lost my all confidence to brand name and your problem adds salt on it. Go back and buy Kodak.
     
  3. georg16nik

    georg16nik Member

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    Raphael,
    a storing problem might occur in a very, very extreme case :confused: You mentioned lower than 17/18°C, I guess the humidity was in a reasonable limits? Would You share the batch number of Your roll?

    I shoot a lot of the Rollei films, mainly those manufactured by Agfa and so far, after hundreds of rolls its been all excellent.
    Recently I shot a few rolls of Rollei RPX100 120 and it was all good.

    G
     
  4. piu58

    piu58 Member

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    Superpan 200 is sensitve to infrared light too. It may be that the backing paper lets paass some of the light, especially if you have a camera wit ah red window.
    I used much of SP 200 with my Rolleiflex without any problems.
     
  5. Simon R Galley

    Simon R Galley Subscriber

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    Dear Raphael,

    This is called 'wrapper offset' : Where the printed information on the backing strip transfers to the film. Georg and Piu58 are correct, high humidity can affect the wrapper but its the red view window that is the usual cause...ensure it is covered.

    I have seen more than a few posts where people 'complain' that the printing on our ILFORD wrapper is too feint.....its like that for a purpose it makes 'wrapper offset' a lot less likely.

    Simon. ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :
     
  6. Rudeofus

    Rudeofus Subscriber

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    Dear Umut,

    you treat old Rollei cameras and modern Rollei film as if they came from the same company, but that's widely incorrect. The Rollei camera company still exists and apparently still manufactures cameras but under the name Franke&Heidecke. You may or may not like the Rollei 35, but please consider that under the Rollei camera brand a wide range of consumer and professional products were sold with varying quality and reliability standards.

    The Rollei brand used for photographic film and paper is an empty shell name (think Polaroid, AEG, Westinghouse, Commodore) under which a range of different materials (Foma paper, Agfa film, Fuji dev chemicals, ...) are sold. Quality may be variable, but as others have pointed out, this particular instance could well be a case of operator error (i.e. don't use IR sensitive film with certain cameras).
     
  7. jmdco

    jmdco Member

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    Dear Raphael,

    Keep your film in the freezer. At -0°C, the maturation process is stopped. Before using a film, two hours out of the box.

    Yours
     
  8. Raphael

    Raphael Subscriber

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    Hi all,

    Wow, so many kinds answers, thanks you apugers ! :smile:
    I am honored to see my thread was even read by Mr Simon Galley himself !

    @georg16nik : It's a good point, humidity, here, is somewhat high in open air, during all the year. I'm living almost in seaside, it's an oceanic climate, after all ! In my basement, where I store the films I need in a short time, humidity oscillate between 60% and 80%. It's rather high, but I try to limit it with an electric deshumidifier appliance, and films are often stored in metal box with a small bag of dessicant. I think to this too, but my whole other 120 and 220 films, branded Fuji, Foma and Adox, never (in the exceptions of one "old" batch of Fomapan) showed these marks, in despite they are not all in an airtight plastic container likes the Rollei.

    For the batch number, I can of course share it, on the container, it shows : Batch #670378 exp 03/2014. BTW, I am not new to the Rollei film range, I had already used Retro 100 film in 120, and found it very nice.

    @piu58 : I discover this extended sensitivity in IR, on the net, after exposing this film, maybe I should have been more careful when loading this film !
    @Mr Galley : thanks you for giving me a name to this phenomenon :smile:

    In fact, I have no red window on my camera, it's a standard 120 removable back for a Bronica SQ. One in one, I think my problem came from IR, but how ? I don't recall precisely how I loaded the back, it was certainly under attenuated light (not total darkness).

    Should I know something about these backs and IR ?

    I already used 120 IR film several times, like Ilford SFX200, Efke 820Ir, or Konica 750, with good success but it wasn't with this camera.

    @Mustapha : Like Rudy (Rudeofus), I don't throw Rollei cameras and films in the same bag. You find the Rollei films expensive, and you are certainly right, I paid it about 3.70€, but 120 Kodak films are almost in a par with this price (3,56€ at fotoimpex for Tmax 100) !
    Even the Fomapan, which was a few years ago on the cheap, are now well above 3 euros/roll.

    @jmdco : In fact, I have a three stage storage process :wink: Long conserved films are in a deep-freezer (under -20°C), I have film in my fridge (under 7°C), and finally in "low" ambiant temperature (in the basement). The later is often used when better half of mine became to rant about the room taken by multicolored small cardboard boxes the fridge :wink:

    Thanks you again to all, for your useful answers.

    Best regards,

    Raphael
     
  9. pacorocha

    pacorocha Member

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    same problen on REtro 100 tonal

    20 rolls of Rollei Retro 100 Tonal with this problem.. numbers, etc. Batch nº: 100600 exp date 05/2014.
     

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  10. richyd

    richyd Member

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    I noticed on the Maco site last week that they have no stock of 120 Superpan 200 and wondered whether there was a problem so it might be worth contacting them with your experiences. They also have no stock of RPX100 in 120 size. I tried a roll of this and although I liked the tonality 2 frames had strange multiple vertical lines. No Retro 400S either.
     
  11. piu58

    piu58 Member

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    This is the same film.
     
  12. georg16nik

    georg16nik Member

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    Both films are still not available.. I hope is something temporarily.
     
  13. piu58

    piu58 Member

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    From time to time there are delivery problems with every film. It is a fine idea to have some dozens of the most needed films at home.
    SP200/Retro 400s is Agfa Aviapan 200, an aerial film. I did not hear anything about stopping it's production. So we can have hope for a next lot.
     
  14. georg16nik

    georg16nik Member

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    That's what I was hope too. Let them pack another batch.
    My freezer reserves are towards the lower end.

    Thanks, Uwe!