Problem with XP2 Super in Digibase C-41 chemistry

Discussion in 'Color: Film, Paper, and Chemistry' started by JaZ99, Jan 14, 2011.

  1. JaZ99

    JaZ99 Member

    Messages:
    58
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2009
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Hi, I ran into the problem I couldn't solve by myself. Recently I've bought Rollei Digibase C-41 chemistry and prepared my first batch. First 2 films were developed OK, but after that strange things happened. Earch roll has some strange residue on both sides which looks like a glue or syrup with tiny airbubbles trapped inside. This is visible only when looking at the film at angle. Scans are mostly quite OK.

    But yesterday I've developed my very first XP2 Super roll and it was horrible. The syrup-like thing is more pronounced and it shows up on scans.

    Below I'm attaching the example scan (@1800ppi)

    The chemistry is not exhausted yet (it happened at 1/2 of declared capacity).
    I've used demineralized water to prepare chemistry.
    I used the chemistry to develop Kodak Portra and Fuji Superia films.

    I will appreciate any tips or advices.

    Janusz

    P.S. I do my own E-6 and traditional B&W processing, and never had such problem before.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. mikecnichols

    mikecnichols Member

    Messages:
    345
    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2010
    Location:
    Marion, VA
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I would guess you are going with the given instructions by Rollei. What I do is I give water baths between bleach and fix and fix and stabilizer. I also do the full 6m30s bleach and 6m30s fix. The water baths really help and I think the longer bleach and fix times do as well to clean unwanted gunk. Lastly, a thorough squeegee is a must when you take the film(s) out. One precise swipe down the roll should be enough.

    Here's a link to the combined instructions I made for myself. I do everything based from 37.8ºC, so watch the times if you use a different temperature.

    http://www.mikecnichols.com/darkroom/c-41ProcessTable.pdf
     
  3. JaZ99

    JaZ99 Member

    Messages:
    58
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2009
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    I process my negatives similar way as my E-6 slides, which includes wash between every bath, I do not squeeze. My E-6 slides are pristine.

    I compared my routine with your pdf, and here are the differences:

    I do wash between color developer and the bleach.
    I do not agitate in stab, just pour it into the tank and pour out after 3-4 mins.

    I suspect the extra wash does no harm, but it might be possible that the stab bath is too long causing problems. Next time I will follow your instructions to the letter.

    Thanks a lot, Janusz
     
  4. mikecnichols

    mikecnichols Member

    Messages:
    345
    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2010
    Location:
    Marion, VA
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    From what I understand, the bleach needs to begin immediately after developing and a stabilzer bath that is longer than said should not make a difference. I am still new to this myself, but I thought I'd share what I have been doing with C-41.
     
  5. JaZ99

    JaZ99 Member

    Messages:
    58
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2009
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Last night I've developed another roll of Reala (120) in the same batch of chemistry.
    I skipped the wash between CD and bleach, and I inspected the film after the final wash and before the stab bath.
    The film was pristine.
    Then I putted the film into the stab bath for 60 seconds (agitation by rotating the knob, not by inversion) and inspected the film again.
    Bingo! The problem appeared again. So I washed the film in demineralized water with drying aid for 60 seconds, and the film looks almost clean now.

    I have no idea what contaminated the stab bath. Maybe I should stick with one film manufacturer (no Kodak/Fuji/Ilford mixing)?

    Is it safe to wash the film after the stab bath? Or should I repeat the stab bath using fresh chemistry?
     
  6. hrst

    hrst Member

    Messages:
    1,300
    Joined:
    May 10, 2007
    Location:
    Finland
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    There have been reports of gunky final rinse (stabilizer) in Rollei Digibase kit here before, so you are not first.

    No film should contaminate the final rinse. I'd guess the problem is in Rollei kit, unless you have put something unwanted to the bath.

    You shouldn't wash after final rinse, and therefore should repeat the final rinse using fresh and well-known chemistry, preferably from a major manufacturer if possible.
     
  7. JaZ99

    JaZ99 Member

    Messages:
    58
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2009
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Thanks! I think that the problem is with the Rollei, too. I'm always using the same brand of demineralized water. Since I'm using good lab-grade bottles (Kartell PE bottles - one bottle for one kind of chemistry - I never reuse plastic bottle for something else), I do not suspect that the bottles are the source of the contamination.
     
  8. JaZ99

    JaZ99 Member

    Messages:
    58
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2009
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    I have prepared the new batch of chemistry (from the same concentrate). This time I used injection water (very pure distilled water) instead of demineralized one.
    The problem vanished. Since the water is the only thing I have changed, I think the demineralized water was contaminated or not clean enough.
     
  9. pentaxpete

    pentaxpete Subscriber

    Messages:
    257
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2010
    Location:
    Brentwood, E
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    can I add a few remarks ?
    First, I have had RETICULATION of the backing gelatine layer on XP2 Super if I Pre-Soak before the Colour Developer -- but it does not occur on C41 COLOUR films I have done. I sent a sample to Ilford Ltd and they said do NOT pre-soak .
    then, on looking at your strange 'micro-bubbles' I have had the SAME thing on ORWO NP22 120 B&W rollfilms -- I sent a sample to the ORWO company in Germany and they said my B&W FIXER was too exhausted and they got rid of it by re-fixing in a fresh bath -- not had those effects on any other films though and I use a 2-bath B&W fixer system, Ilford Hypam.
     
  10. pentaxuser

    pentaxuser Subscriber

    Messages:
    8,048
    Joined:
    May 9, 2005
    Location:
    Daventry, No
    Shooter:
    35mm
    That's a useful tip. Most who pre-soak colour neg films would stick to pre-soaking with XP2 Super on the basis that it is C41 film with the colour taken out. However it would seem NOT to be the same at all in terms of pre-soaking.

    The difficulty without pre-soak is getting the film up to the right temp but with XP2 Super this may not be so critical and presumably can be achieved by putting the film in the tank and standing it in water at the right temp for a few minutes, although without the measurable medium of water I've no idea how you'd know when the dry film has got up to the right temp or near enough to make no difference?

    Any thoughts anyone?


    pentaxuser
     
  11. JaZ99

    JaZ99 Member

    Messages:
    58
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2009
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    My problem is NOT a reticulation. I can wash it out :wink: And it is caused by the stab bath -- as I wrote before -- I inspected the films before and after stab bath.
    I nailed down to water - everything else was the same. Same temperatures, same film batch numbers, same chemistry concentrates, same bottles. Only one thing was changed -- water used to make stab bath.