Rodinal

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by noseoil, Jul 17, 2005.

  1. noseoil

    noseoil Member

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    Question for the temple guards about keeping properties. My birthday is today and my son presented me with a box of goodies from a neighbor who has moved away. There are two 4 ounce containers (un-opened) of the magic elixer in the package, along with some other goodies. No dates I can see about "use by..."

    Since they are unopened, how long do they last?

    If they are still good, would the fridge be the best place to store them (my darkroom is suffering in this 35th day of 100 plus temps, still no rain yet). Daytime temps are now running 85-88f degrees inside.

    How long, once opened, will they keep?

    Starting point for Efke 25 in 35mm and 1:100 stand dilution?

    Starting point for Efke 100 in 4x5 1:100 for stand development?
    Thanks in advance. tim (A 1951 model year)
     
  2. fschifano

    fschifano Member

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    I'm not a big Rodinal user so what I have around tends to stay around for a good long while. The current batch has gone from a pale amber color to darned near tar black and still works. My guess is that in an unopened bottle, age matters even less and that it is probably still good. There have been accounts of 20+ year old bottles being opened for the first time and used with good results posted both here and other places around the net. Can't help you with developemt time for the Efke films though. I don't use the stuff.
     
  3. Alex Hawley

    Alex Hawley Member

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    Happy Birthday Tim!

    AFAIK, Rodinal keeps for a long, long time, even after the bottle is opened. My only data point is the bottle I bought three years ago and its still good.
     
  4. garryl

    garryl Member

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  5. photomc

    photomc Member

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    HAPPY BIRTHDAY, TIM!!!

    It seems to last forever, though sure some perfer fresh, others perfer aged..kind of like wine.

    Don't know, but would be inclined to leave it in a cool, dark place at room temp, because large changes in temp might be more problematic than a constant 85 degrees...sorry to hear the inferno has not let up.

    Can't help with that one, might check the charts over at JandC

    Have done this, using 1+100 stand would not develope for less than 40 min and usually let it go for an hour (give or take 5 or 10min). That is at 50, so give that some thought. While I do not think the developer is exhausted, it is pretty close, usually use 10 ml of Rodinal in 1 Liter...more recently using 1+50 in a drum and Unicolor roller base, times are 15 min (at 80 degrees).

    Good Luck,
     
  6. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

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    I'm now using a bottle of decades old Rodinal (the glass bottle with the rubeer stopper) and it works just fine.

    For dev times, consult the Massive Dev. Chart at digitaltruth.com, unblinking eye.com and, as said, j and c.
     
  7. modafoto

    modafoto Subscriber

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    I wouldn't worry about the time is has been kept. I have done a film Rodinal that was almost 40 years old (and opened before 1970). It was still ok (needed about 10% more development though).
    So if you keep it under 10 years I would not worry nor extend development time.

    I would not store it in the fridge as I have heard that some devs will crystalize and it will be tough to solve the crystals in the fluid again. I store mine in the dark in a well-ventilated room. No problems with Rodinal or HC-110.

    And...HAPPY BIRTHDAY! :D

    Morten
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 17, 2005
  8. garryl

    garryl Member

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  9. Earl Dunbar

    Earl Dunbar Member

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    Oh, I loved those bottles and stoppers! I wish Rodinal were still shipped that way.

    Earl
     
  10. gnashings

    gnashings Inactive

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    It will NEVER die... unless you use it, its going to outlive you :smile:
    Stuff is awesome!
     
  11. modafoto

    modafoto Subscriber

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    We didn't lie when we, the Church, said it was immortal! :D
     
  12. David A. Goldfarb

    David A. Goldfarb Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    They say it burns but is not consumed.
     
  13. df cardwell

    df cardwell Subscriber

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    Happy Birthday ! Because my own experience over the past 35 years fits pretty well with the 'Rodinal Legend', let me caution you to try it out first... that aside, don't store it in the fridge and don't boil it.

    When I try Rodinal 1+100 with a new film for semi-still development, I double the suggested time and agitate for 10 seconds at the midpoint, and go from there. Most of my film is done in tanks, and the single agitation interval doesn't sacrifice much of the effect while reducing the possibilty density irregularity. Will you try thr 4x5 film in a tray ? You should have no problems either way, tank or tray.

    Two things to keep in mind about Rodinal, new or old, is that it is powerful, but slow. And extending the development time doesn't alter the curve shape... only the proportion of agitation to the time of development does that. So it is an easy matter to adjust the density of a negative my simply adjusting the development time.

    Rodinal is always a matter of testing and believing your eyes. If you need more density, increase the time. If the highlights are too dense, reduce the agitation. If the contrast is right, and the density is wrong, fix the exposure.

    Have fun.

    Don
     
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  15. noseoil

    noseoil Member

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    Don and all, many thanks for the b-day wishes and excellent advice.

    "If you need more density, increase the time. If the highlights are too dense, reduce the agitation. If the contrast is right, and the density is wrong, fix the exposure." This is very good news, I'm going to have to adjust thinking a bit around this curious behavior (mine & the developer) but it seems I may have stumbled upon the "Holy Grail" of developers. Will thank my son again. tim

    P.S. And the burning bush too? Egads!
     
  16. geraldatwork

    geraldatwork Member

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    I just finished printing my first roll of Rodinal. The film was Delta-400 developed 1+50 for 19 minutes with 3 inversions every minute. The tonality was really nice. Impressive. The particular shot I enlarged was about one stop underexposed but still had detail in the shadows. However the grain was too prominent, too coarse. Is there any way to soften the grain somewhat. Not totally like a solvent developer just a little.Because I like the sharpness.My enlargent was an 8X10 I'd be aftaid what the grain would look like at 11X14.
     
  17. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

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    Is there any way to soften the grain somewhat. Not totally like a solvent developer just a little.Because I like the sharpness.My enlargent was an 8X10 I'd be aftaid what the grain would look like at 11X14.[/QUOTE]



    Apparently, there is. There is a good article, "Appreciating Rodinal" at unblinkingeye.com about the wonders of Rodinal and there are several threads here about adding sodium sulfite, ascorbic acid, and borax to Rodinal to soften the grain. Patrick Gainer has quite a bit of knowledge about this and if I'm not mistaken, wrote the "Fog Be Gone" article at unblinkingeye.


    I say "apparently" because while I have done these and processed the film, I have yet to make prints from the negs. The negs do show promise, however.
     
  18. Soeren

    Soeren Member

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    There can be only one :smile:
    Søren
     
  19. garryl

    garryl Member

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    Or two- in case you drop the first bottle:D
     
  20. gainer

    gainer Subscriber

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    Apparently, there is. There is a good article, "Appreciating Rodinal" at unblinkingeye.com about the wonders of Rodinal and there are several threads here about adding sodium sulfite, ascorbic acid, and borax to Rodinal to soften the grain. Patrick Gainer has quite a bit of knowledge about this and if I'm not mistaken, wrote the "Fog Be Gone" article at unblinkingeye.


    I say "apparently" because while I have done these and processed the film, I have yet to make prints from the negs. The negs do show promise, however.[/QUOTE]

    I don't think ascorbate softens the grain, but it makes it somewhat smaller. If you try it, remember that what you add must be either the potassium or sodium ascorbate, not ascorbic acid. The acid reduces the pH too much. If you have only ascorbic or erythorbic acid (either works as well) mix 4 grams of it with 2 grams of common baking soda in a small amount of water and let the effervescence subside before adding it to water to make a liter. Then add 20 ml of Rodinal concentrate. The developing times will be about the same as Rodinal 1+25.

    My comment when I first tried it was that it makes Rodinal work like the idealized Rodinal. The grain is sharp but not large.
     
  21. P C Headland

    P C Headland Subscriber

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    You can try a higher dilution, say 1+100. I used this for APX400 and the grain (in 6x6) was kept well in check. You may like to try it with semi-stand or reduced agitation. I get good results from 15s agitation for first 3 minutes, then one inversion every three minutes till done. Works well for Neopan 400 and TriX.

    Paul
     
  22. Thomas Bertilsson

    Thomas Bertilsson Member

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    I can confirm that. My supplies are stored in my basement in a corner closet which is not insulated. In the winter the temp there creeps down towards 50*F, and it was cold enough to crystalize my open bottle of Rodinal.
    The developer still worked fine, careful just not to pour the crystals into the mix, as it might damage the film emulsion (although I doubt it). I extract my 20ml with a syringe.

    Apart from that, I've had Rodinal sitting on my shelf for two years in an opened bottle, and what comes out is a darkbrown slur, but it seems to work great anyway.

    - Thomas

     
  23. jimgalli

    jimgalli Subscriber

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    HAPPY BIRTHDAY

    Happy Birthday Tim!!

    I don't know either, I just wanted to say happy birthday :wink: I have a bottle from 1971 that came with a C1 outfit. I keep threatening to give it a try so I can brag about oldest bottle etc,. Maybe this week while my bride is busy teaching VBS.

    I did some shots of the most beautiful "Prickly Poppies" Ive ever seen with the Mono Lake burn in the background on my way over to Geary's. Was thinking of you.
     
  24. jimgalli

    jimgalli Subscriber

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    Should work fine in hell.
     
  25. Willie Jan

    Willie Jan Member

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    i use the rodinal for efke sheet (4x5) film diluted at 1+50.
    100 asa film set as 50 asa, and developed at 20 degrees, for 10 minutes.
    invert the tank each 30 seconds.
     
  26. jimgalli

    jimgalli Subscriber

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    1971 bottle opened

    This is an old glass bottle that came with my C1 Calumet outfit that brought me my Ries Tripod. It was still sealed until last evening. Came out very brown. It was warm in the darkroom so I used 5.25 minutes 1:100 for 5 sheets of Efke 25 in the Jobo 3010. Tim I was thinking of you and your recent (still?) burn of a favorite area. This is just S of Mono Lake on US 120. I've never seen such beauty set in stark sorrow.

    [​IMG]
    "Hope"