Rollei PAN 25/Adox PAN 25 and Rollei ORTHO 25/Adox PAN 25

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Jacques D., Jan 23, 2008.

  1. Jacques D.

    Jacques D. Member

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    For some time I have been using Rollei PAN 25 and Rollei ORTHO 25.Both are excellent films. Recently Adox is selling similar film : ADOX PAN 25 and ADOX ORT 25. It is rumoured that Adox PAN 25 is exactly the same film as Rollei PAN 25 and that ADOX ORT 25 is exactly the same as Rollei ORTHO 25. Can anybody confirm this? The only information I could find is that Rollei uses German FilmoTec (formerly OrWo) emulsion, while Adox PAN & ORT are "made in Germany". BTW, Adox is much cheaper than Rollei....

    Anyway it is good to see that companies like Maco/Rollei and Adox are selling niche prodcuts like these...

    Jacques
     
  2. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    Until Mirko/Fotoimpex begins manufacture of film again using the Agfa formulae there is only one film manufacturer in Germany which is as you say Filmotec. Fotoimpex'x Adox brand does offer very good value for money and would be my preferred choice.

    Rebadging films is very common and its strange how prices can vary so much for essentially the same product, another example would be the Bergger re-badged Forte films & papers.

    Ian
     
  3. cmo

    cmo Member

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    The maker of all Rollei film and chemistry products is a company named Maco, and I only know them as a company that relabels cheap products and sells them at high prices :D As far as I remember they justify this because it is so costly changing the original description of the products into "world premiere no-grain 3200 ASA film that is so sharp it is causing pleasurable sensation...".

    Adox has an excellent reputation, especially in Germany. I have started with a few rolls of Adox 25 roll film some days ago, and the results are impressive.

    It's like with many other products: the original is quite often cheaper than the original with a different label. In-betweeners need money, too.
     
  4. Jacques D.

    Jacques D. Member

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    Maco does not make film. They distribute film, formerly under their own brand name (Maco) and since 2004 under the Rollei brand name. The makers of Rollei film are Agfa-Gevaert (Belgium) (ATP, RSD, Superpan 200, CN200, CN400,IR400), Agfa-Leverkusen (now defunct) (Retro 100, Retro 400) and FilmoTec (Ortho 25, Pan 25, R³). Maco branded films were made by Efke and Ilford, but are no longer available now.

    Adox does not make film either (but are planning to do so later this year). Adox CHS films are made by Efke, while Adox CHM films are made by Ilford. I do not know who makes Adox Pan 25 and Adox Ort 25, but probably this could be FilmoTec.

    I have good experience both with Adox (CHS25) and with Rollei (ORT 25 and PAN 25)
     
  5. mmcclellan

    mmcclellan Subscriber

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    There are other threads on this subject, but if I am not mistaken, they are all Efke 25 -- and it is a superb film, especially when developed in Rodinal or R-09. I believe other threads will show that these are all re-badged Efke 25, but I could be wrong.
     
  6. Jacques D.

    Jacques D. Member

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    Adox CHS 25/50/100 is re-labelled EFKE, as well as some of the old MACO-stuff. Rollei definitely is not relabelled EFKE. Efke 25 is superb indeed, especially the tonality.
     
  7. cmo

    cmo Member

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    As far as I can read it on the FOTOIMPEX web site Efke and Adox is actually the same, they just changed the name to the original name Adox.
     
  8. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

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    I don't want to be accused of starting/spreading a rumor, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought Rollei 25 was leftover APX 25? Didn't I read a thread about that here not long a go?
     
  9. AgX

    AgX Member

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    Adox and Efke is not the same.

    Efke is Fotokemika, a Croation film manufacturer who produces films for gross customers as Fotoimpex or Maco (Mahn) and others.

    Adox is a brand name used by two companies. One is a Canadian the other a German, namely Fotoimpex.
     
  10. Jacques D.

    Jacques D. Member

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    Adox CHS 25/50/100 is made by EFKE in Croatia, Adox CHM 125/400 is made by Ilford in England, Adox ORT 25 and PAN 25 is "made in Germany" (FilmoTec?),Adox CMS 20 is definitely not EFKE....
     
  11. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    Yes and No.

    Yes Fotoimpex are selling the EFKE film as Adox, and very clearly stating that, and of course the film was made by ADOX before the plant & name were sold by Dupont to EFKE. EFKE later dropping the brand name.

    However as Fotoimpex now own the brand name they can sell what they like badged as Adox. So they are also selling re-branded Iford film as Adox and film from other manufacturers.

    To be fair Fotoimpex do give clear descriptions of their films and papers so there shouldn't be any confusion.

    Ian
     
  12. pentaxuser

    pentaxuser Subscriber

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    Sounds like at least a couple of articles for B&W Photography. I hope the editor is watching.

    pentaxuser
     
  13. Jacques D.

    Jacques D. Member

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    There is no leftover APX 25. Agfa stopped production in 2000, long before the disinvestment of Agfa Leverkusen by Agfa-Gevaert in 2004 and before Agfa Leverkusen went banktrupt in 2005. Maco is reselling leftover AGFA APX 100 and 400 as Rollei 100 and 400, but no APX 25. FotoImpex/Adox however, is planning to make 25/100/400 based on APX-technology in their own plant starting in 2008.
     
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  15. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

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    OK, it's the 100 & 400 I was thinking of. Thanks.

    If APX films were made again, (I know some folks say it won't be the same, but if they came close! :smile: ) that would make my day!
     
  16. Simon R Galley

    Simon R Galley Subscriber

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    Dear All,

    Just to be clear, ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology have not sold our film as private label since the management buyout in February 2005.

    Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :
     
  17. Ian Grant

    Ian Grant Subscriber

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    That's a very fair comment Simon, but at the present time re-branded Ilford films are still available, albeit of pre-Feb 2005 manufacture. It can be confusing when the same product is sold under a wide variety of names, this happens more with film from other manufacturers.

    Ian
     
  18. Simon R Galley

    Simon R Galley Subscriber

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    Dear Ian,

    You are absolutely correct, it is confusing :

    Simon ILFORD photo / HARMAN technology Limited :
     
  19. Jacques D.

    Jacques D. Member

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    Harman (Ilford) will be subcontractor for Bergger :

    http://www.bergger.com/us/release.html

    Jacques
     
  20. braxus

    braxus Member

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    There was a previous post on this a couple months back of someone asking what Adox Pan 25 was. It was confirmed in the post by a user that Adox Pan 25 is the same film as Rollei Pan 25, and same story of the Ortho versions of Adox and Rollei. Read the tech info on the two films between the two companies and you will notice the film info is the same. Keep in mind Adox also puts out the Efke 25 film, but that is under another Adox name. By the way you will not get a response from Mirko on this as he didn't respond to previous posts on this very subject.
     
  21. Henning Serger

    Henning Serger Member

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    Hello,

    it is possible to stop the confusion, because there is sufficient official information directly from the german manufacturers/distributors Maco (Rollei Film) and Adox (Fotoimpex). This topic was recently discussed in the german aphog forum with official statements (both companies are active members on aphog).

    I will try to translate the most important aspects. First a brief look into history: Maco Pan 25, Maco Ortho 25, Maco IR 820, Maco UP 100plus, Maco PO 100, Maco UP 64 and Maco TP 64c were exclusively made by Fotokemika (Efke, Croatia) for Maco. These films were special, selected production runs.This production was independant from the 'normal' Efke production.

    The cooperation between Maco and Efke stopped some years ago due to reorganised production structures at Fotokemika. Therefore Maco films made by Fotokemika are history. There is no Efke film in the current Rollei film programme.
    Then Fotoimpex started to sell some Efke films under the Adox brand.

    Maco introduced a new film programme under the Rollei brand at Photokina 2004. These films are/were made by Filmotec (Wolfen, Germany), Agfa-Gevaert (Mortsel, Belgium) and AgfaPhoto (Leverkusen, Germany).

    Rollei Retro 100/400: AgfaPhoto APX 100/400 (last production run in 2005, Leverkusen).
    Rollei Pan 25: Made by Filmotec. It is an improved Orwo NP 15 emulsion with finer grain, different base and redesigned for new raw materials and more modern production processes at the new Filmotec plant in Wolfen.
    Rollei Ortho 25: Made by Filmotec.
    Rollei R³: Made by Filmotec.

    All other films of the current Rollei film programme, including the new ATP high resolution film and the Superpan 200 film, are made by Agfa-Gevaert in Mortsel (Belgium). If you are interested in some pictures of Agfas current film production, have a look:

    http://www.maco-photo.de/files/images/production_photogr_film.pdf

    Maco does not have exclusive contracts with Filmotec and Agfa-Gevaert. Both companies are free to sell some of their products to other distributors.
    Filmotec did this with Pan 25 and Ortho 25 (= Adox Pan 25, Adox Ortho 25).
    And Agfa-Gevaert is selling some of their films to other distributers as well:
    The high resolution films Gigabitfilm, Spur Orthopan UR and Adox CMS 20 are made by Agfa-Gevaert.

    If I say 'made by' I mean emulsioning and coating. Cutting, packing etc. is made by other specialists, e.g. Photostar in Germany, but also some others.

    Adox:
    Adox CHS films: Made by Fotokemika.
    Adox CHM films: Made by Ilford (old stock from the time before Ilfords management buy-out in 2005).
    Adox CMS 20: Made by Agfa-Gevaert.
    Adox Pan 25, Ortho 25: Made by Filmotec.

    I hope your questions are now answered.

    For some further details you may have a look at:
    http://www.aphog.de/forum/viewtopic.php?p=46714#46714
    http://www.maco-photo.de/files/images/SW_55_06.pdf
    http://www.adox.de/english/ADOX_Films/ADOX_Films.html

    Best regards from Germany,
    Henning
     
  22. Uhner

    Uhner Member

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    Thanks for making things clear.

    Claes
     
  23. AgX

    AgX Member

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    Henning,

    Please be fair.
    It's only a few months ago that here at Apug Fotoimpex stayed silent on the question about the Adox Pan 25.

    And this is an worldwide site and you cannot expect members to be informed about what goes on at a certain German site. (I myself look into that site only at rare occasions...)

    And to my understanding it was the industry who started that confusion.
     
  24. Henning Serger

    Henning Serger Member

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    Dear AgX,

    I think I am very fair. I know that 99% or probably more of the apug members don't look at the german aphog forum. I would never expect them to do so, most don't understand german.

    And that is the reason why I have posted these informations here. Now these apuglers, who are interested in this subject have the informations they have asked for. I cannot do more.

    Best regards,
    Henning
     
  25. AgX

    AgX Member

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    I have to be fair...
    Sorry Henning, I did not have my glasses on and read "Is it...?" making a rethorical question out of your post.

    But you have to admit only short ago it was the industry who tried to veil their enterprises. And those latest postings by Maco at Aphog were quite surprising to me in their seeming openness.
     
  26. Henning Serger

    Henning Serger Member

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    It's OK, no problem.

    Briefly for your information: Most of all these facts, especially who is making which films for Maco/Rollei was already published in 2006 in the german photo magazine "Schwarzweiss", issues 54 and 55.

    Best regards,
    Henning