Selenium Toner Dilution - What's yours for Dmax?

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Renato Tonelli, Apr 12, 2009.

  1. Renato Tonelli

    Renato Tonelli Subscriber

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    I use Kodak Rapid Selenium at 1:19
    What dilution do you use for Dmax?
     
  2. brian steinberger

    brian steinberger Member

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    I think it depends more on which paper you're using and the response that paper will give you. All papers will show improved Dmax with selenium, but some will also show a color change, especially warmtone papers. For example, a dilution of 1+19 might work well with a warmtone paper for slightly improved Dmax when little color change is wanted, where as a 1+9 dilution might be better for toning a neutral paper, such as Ilford MGIV which I believe responds better to lower dilutions of selenium.

    That all being said, I use one dilution, 1+9 for anywhere from 1 minute to 20 minutes depending upon the paper (mostly Ilford warmtone & MGIV), but I also like color change in my photographs. Hope this helps.
     
  3. ozphoto

    ozphoto Subscriber

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    I also use Kodak Rapid Selenium at 1:19.
    For me using Afga paper or the Fotospeed I am also currently using, I tone for 3 minutes. Gives me a nice DMax and archival results too.

    To be honest, I use it more for archival needs than the actual DMax result, but this dilution works nicely for me on both counts.
     
  4. Mike Keers

    Mike Keers Member

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    Not to hijack the thread but...

    I've only recently started using selenium and done maybe eight or ten enlargements with KRS. I was primarily interested in its toning effects. With so many dilution levels being mentioned in the literature, I simply started with 1:3, and leave them in for 6-7 minutes. This was chosen for no other reason than my possibly erroneous assumption that a stronger solution would give more results, ie., deeper toning or color change. Can anyone address the effect various dilutions have as far as toning? I hear some people go with a very weak solution (1:30 or even 1:50 or higher) but leave the print in a very long time--20-30 minutes.

    If this dilution stuff has been discussed on APUG before (what hasn't?) can anyone point to the discussion? Thx!
     
  5. Colin Corneau

    Colin Corneau Subscriber

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    Directions with your toner should give you a good idea.

    Mine is Ilford selenium toner, and it suggests 1:3 for colour shift and 1:19 or 1:20 for archival purposes. I have settled on 1:10 for a little of both, but that's personal taste.
     
  6. L Gebhardt

    L Gebhardt Subscriber

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    I use 1:32 (4 oz in a gallon) and tone for about 6 minutes. I don't like the tone shift you get with more concentrated dilution's. This way I get a bit of dmax increase and the archival benefits with hardly any color change.
     
  7. catem

    catem Member

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    I dilute selenium 1 : 9 for archival purposes (sometimes 1 : 13) and colour change (normally 4 mins min.); and 1 : 20 for (normally 2 mins min.) for greater Dmax.

    I : 9 is thought to be the maximum dilution at which you can reap the full archival benefits of selenium (if you don't see a colour change, at least in a paper that will normally show colour change at the lower dilutions, then the effect isn't archival. This is not what I was taught in the 1990's when high dilutions were used for archival purposes, but the thinking on this appears to have changed).
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 15, 2009
  8. Bruce Osgood

    Bruce Osgood Membership Council Council

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    With Harmon/Kentmere Fineprint Semi Mat I use KRST 1 + 9 for 4 minutes. The tones do not change color and you can see Zones I, II and III as degrees of a rich black.
     
  9. Martin Aislabie

    Martin Aislabie Subscriber

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    From my experiments with Toning - any dilution can achieve deep DMax - its just how long you have to wait to get there.

    The colour shift is more pronounced with stringer dilutions.

    If you over-tone the DMax does drop off

    Warmtone papers colour shift far more noticeably than neutral tone papers like Ilford MGFB.

    Toning is a complex business - almost everything seem to effect the results, paper, developer, developing time, stop bath, time in the stop bath, fixer, time in the fixer, wash time & wash water quality.

    It does seem to be worth mixing your Toner with pure water (reverse osmosis or distilled)

    Tim Rudman has done an excellent book on Toning which is an almost exhaustive definitive guide to the subject - http://www.amazon.co.uk/Master-Phot...r_1_10?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1239971809&sr=1-10

    Good luck

    Martin
     
  10. markbau

    markbau Member

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    I have always taken David Vestal's advice in an old book of his and diluted it 1 part toner to 40 parts working strength washing aid for 10 minutes. No colour change but a noticeable increase in dmax.

    mark