Selenium Toning Ilford MGFB gloss warm tone

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Leon, Dec 3, 2003.

  1. Leon

    Leon Member

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    I have some probs with this specific paper. After selenium toning & when dry, the paper shows patches of small, white, hexagonal cell-type marks in the emulsion (like honeycomb). I have tried using kodak Rapid Selenium Toner, and Fotospeed selenium toner, both with the same effect. I have tried using wash-aid, not using wash aid (during the pre-toning wash or after or both or neither), long washes, short washes, adjusting fixing times to minimum and very long periods, wash temps, toner temps, toner dilution etc etc etc. None of which has made anydifference - the marks on teh finish are still there - indiscrminate of shadow or highlight, or unexposed. It doesnt cover the whole finish - just patches - and they're not evident until the paper is dry.

    This hasnt happened with MGRC warm tone or any other paper I use - any ideas? Ilford have asked me to send some examples to them for their inspection, but before i do, would like to check if anyone here has had same probs ....
     
  2. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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  3. Bruce Osgood

    Bruce Osgood Membership Council

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    SNIPPING:
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    Have you reviewed your drying technique? The gloss surface of modern VC papers are not meant to be ferrotyped or touching anything. I've tried hang drying until the curl begins and then running them thru a rotery dryer at low temp with emulsion to the canvas - not the chrome drum and even when dried they blotch. Emulsion side to even a warm drum will melt the plastic gloss. I think the only way to dry glossy VC paper is to hang it from clothes pins in a 'clean room' and then a dry mount press using release paper.

    If this is how you're drying them, then I have no clue.
     
  4. MikeK

    MikeK Member

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    Leon:

    what fixer are you using?

    I have found that using an acid/hardeningfix can cause staining problems. I use a two bath regime using a hypo and sulfite mix and have never had a staining problem when using KRST. Another trick is to soak the prints in a 10% Sodium Carbonate solution then give a wash then use KRST.

    Hope this helps

    - Mike
     
  5. Robert Kennedy

    Robert Kennedy Member

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    I have used this same paper with Berg selenium at 1:3 and 1:20 and gotten no such problem.

    It could be some sort of problem with the paper. It sounds like it may be almost mechanical markings that are showing up....maybe some sort of problem with one of the layers not being applied right? I know modern FB paper has many different layers....The toner could be bringing this out.
     
  6. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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  7. Leon

    Leon Member

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    Fixer - ilford Hypam/ rapid fixer either at 1:4 or 1:9.

    Drying - i use a wiper blade, (clean!) then emulsion side up in a warm , clean, dry atmosphere.

    The honeycomb pattern is so exact and regular it leads me to think it's somthing to do with the stucture of the emulsion itself.
     
  8. Aggie

    Aggie Member

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  9. Leon

    Leon Member

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    ok - thanks. I have just dimsantled my dark room, as I am moving very soon - to a house with a much bigger space to print in - i will be including drying screens - so will give that a go. Mind you, Ilford still seemed suprised despite knowing that the prints were dried emulsion up .... and I have always dried like this with no probs with normal MGFB .... the plot thickens.
     
  10. Lex Jenkins

    Lex Jenkins Member

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    If you're using drying screens, try drying the prints face up.

    Before doing this I also noticed marks on my selenium toned prints made on Ilford MG warmtone fiber glossy. The marks were regular enough to be attributable to the drying screens.

    I still squeegee prints to minimize water puddling on the face-up prints. Works for me.

    Same amount of curl and ripple either way.
     
  11. Tom Stanworth

    Tom Stanworth Member

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    Might sound stupid, but the only time I have had anything similar is when using a Nova vertical processor. If FB paper is given insufficient agitation, the honeycomb pattern on the slot walls shows up. his does not happen with RC.