Silver retention

Discussion in 'Color: Film, Paper, and Chemistry' started by Alessandro Serrao, Jun 27, 2010.

  1. Alessandro Serrao

    Alessandro Serrao Member

    Messages:
    998
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2004
    Location:
    Rome, Italy
    Shooter:
    35mm
    I've got an Xp2 developed and printed by IlfordLab recently.
    The prints are somewhat not contrasty; especially in the shadows grain is pronounced, quite visible. I've rated the film 400 as per specs.

    Now, how can I diagnose if it's silver retention or underexposure just by looking at grain in shadows?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 27, 2010
  2. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

    Messages:
    25,900
    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2005
    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    You would need a microscope or do an X-Ray fluorescence analysis to prove retention. I suspect that it is not since it was done by a pro lab.

    PE
     
  3. Alessandro Serrao

    Alessandro Serrao Member

    Messages:
    998
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2004
    Location:
    Rome, Italy
    Shooter:
    35mm
    [​IMG]

    This is the actual print from IlfordLab.
    Notice how on the right there's huge grain in the shadow.
    Is the pic underexposed or overexposed?
    I must say that roll of Xp2 expired in jan-2006...
    I'm disappointed with the results anyway.
     
  4. Mainecoonmaniac

    Mainecoonmaniac Subscriber

    Messages:
    3,997
    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2009
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Since it's xp2 film is really a color film, isn't the image on the negative mostly dye and the silver removed during processing?
     
  5. Alessandro Serrao

    Alessandro Serrao Member

    Messages:
    998
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2004
    Location:
    Rome, Italy
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Yes but it can happen that chemistry used is expired, underreplenished or is a blix used instead of a bleach and a separate fixer.
     
  6. Daire Quinlan

    Daire Quinlan Member

    Messages:
    153
    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2008
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    One way I guess of telling might be if you have a scanner with ICE. Do a scan and save out as RGBI if you're able, and then look at the IR channel. If there's a pronounced and identifiable image there then there's probably silver in the negative.
     
  7. Alessandro Serrao

    Alessandro Serrao Member

    Messages:
    998
    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2004
    Location:
    Rome, Italy
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Unfortunately I don't have such scanner.
    I'm beginning to wonder if folks at IlfordLab processed my Xp2 roll in black & white chemistry, not in c41 ones.
    I would define my prints as lacking of contrast, muddy grainy, with blown highlights and grainy shadow, lacking Dmin (black is somewhat a muddy gray).
    The films expired in Jan-2006 but it has been deep-frozen since purchase.
     
  8. railwayman3

    railwayman3 Member

    Messages:
    2,040
    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2008
    Shooter:
    35mm
    I'd ask Ilford....Simon Galley, one of their Directors, posts on here regularly, and their customer support is second-to-none, always willing to investigate any issues with their products.