Source for erythrosine

Discussion in 'Silver Gelatin Based Emulsion Making & Coating' started by wildbillbugman, May 8, 2013.

  1. wildbillbugman

    wildbillbugman Member

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    Hello Everyone,
    I finaly ran out of erythrosine and need a new source. Sigma-Aldrich will not sell me water anymore. Is "red dye #3" the same as erythrosine?
    Bill:munch:
     
  2. kb3lms

    kb3lms Subscriber

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    Yes. From wikipedia: "Erythrosine, also known as Red No. 3"

    Try Alfa Aesar. Erythrosin B is listed on their website. They will only ship to a business address but they were going to sell me a small quantity of Eosin Y for a reasonable price. They also list a number of other dyes, including cyanines. http://www.alfa.com

    -- Jason
     
  3. Mike Wilde

    Mike Wilde Member

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    Try to figure out the CI number ( i think it stands for color index) of the dye. There are good organic chemistry web sites that list dyes by CI and the assocated classic names and also known as lists.

    A lot of dyes are used to stain tissue and thus bring out cell structure. Some react at visible and some and UV , and some are UV only.
     
  4. kb3lms

    kb3lms Subscriber

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    According to wikipedia, the CI is 45430
     
  5. wildbillbugman

    wildbillbugman Member

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    For those interested, Chemsavers has erythrosine.
     
  6. kb3lms

    kb3lms Subscriber

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    This week I found a seller on eBay that sells FD&C Red 3 (Erythrosine) powder. She swears it is the pure food grade dye with no other ingredients, $6.00 per oz. I'll report back if it works or not.

    Also, google Magnacol and try them for dyes. They are out of the UK and sell small quantities of all sorts of dyes erythrosine, rhodamines, eosins, for reasonable prices. No cyanines though. They are on ebay as seller "scuddlebutt3." I got my current batch of erythrosine from them.
     
  7. kb3lms

    kb3lms Subscriber

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    Cyanine Dyes

    Chemsavers also lists a number of cyanine dyes, at least at this time. Not any less expensive than anywhere else but maybe more obtainable.
     
  8. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    Bill, I get mine from ANTEC chemicals (kyantec.com).

    PE
     
  9. Hexavalent

    Hexavalent Subscriber

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    McCormick red food colour might also do the trick: a mix of erythrosine and allura red, some prop glycol and paraben preservative.
     
  10. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    Allura Red is an azo dye which should not hurt the sensitization at all, and will probably just wash out. If you could fix it in the coating it could help make a nice dye bleach material! :D (Just kidding - it would be too dilute to work well.)

    PE
     
  11. dwross

    dwross Subscriber

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    Hi All,

    Photographers' Formulary will be selling dropper bottles of erthyrosin(e) solution soon. It will be in a dilution standardized for emulsion sensitizing. Either Bud or I will let you know when it's ready to order. In about a month, The Light Farm will be posting two ortho recipes using the Formulary's solution. Other sources of erythrosin can be used, of course. It's not expensive (as these things go) but a very little goes a very long way and it can be a mess to mix up, so the Formulary is offering a great service to us.

    A note about McCormick food dyes. The regular red color is not erythrosin (FD&C #3). It is made with #40, which is not a sensitizing dye. It is the McCormick "Neon" set that has Neon Pink, which is made with #3 and #40, that does the trick. http://thelightfarm.com/cgi-bin/htmlgen.py?content=18Jan2012

    d
     
  12. Hexavalent

    Hexavalent Subscriber

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    Depending on where you look, ingredients of the 'regular' McCormick red list FD&C 40 and sometimes FD&C 3 (erythrosine).

    Read the label!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 26, 2013
  13. dwross

    dwross Subscriber

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    http://www.btps.ca/files/PDF/MSDS/red_food_color.pdf

    In addition to personal telephone confirmation by the lab folks at McCormick.

    If by "depending on where you look" you mean random internet crap, yes, I'm sure you can find anything. Here's a lovely site that is case in point: http://grannyspantry.blogspot.com/2012/01/food-colouring.html
    The numbers 3 and 40 are flipped even though the hyperlinked reference is correct.

    I'm sure I couldn't say the sun rises in the east without you saying I'm wrong, Ian. "Why" is a mystery to me. Regardless, I'd hate to have people use McC red and fail to get an ortho emulsion. That just feeds the myth that making emulsions is too hard/random/unsatisfactory/expensive to even try.
     
  14. Hexavalent

    Hexavalent Subscriber

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    I did not say, or mean to imply that you were wrong Denise. Perhaps grannyspantry.com is FOS - it's not the kind of website that I would trust for technical data.
    Did McCormick tell you what the ingredients of the Canadian products? They are quite often different - allowed food colourants are not the same in every country.

    I agree that there is a plethora of false, misleading, incomplete, and sometimes dangerous information on the internet. Even many of the formulae and methodology for emulsion available on the internet fall under that banner.

    Nor did I say or imply that emulsion making is difficult. Suggesting that people read a label to ensure that they are using the correct ingredient is not 'complicated'.
    Franky, anybody who doesn't read the fine print deserves to have a failed emulsion - having to pour silver down the drain is a firm teacher.

    The biggest variable in making an emulsion is technique and accuracy. Kitchen-sink emulsions can indeed yield a nice looking image. Applying precision and controls to the exact same formulation can yield an excellent emulsion.

    "Why" comes to my mind when you suggest that I'm trying to dissuade people from trying there hand at emulsion make. I do no such thing.
    Personally, I seek to create fine-grain, fast, fog-free, stable and repeatable emulsions - that is my goal, and to do so has required precision work.
    Boring old "AJ-12" can be boosted up to and likely beyond ISO 50, but to do so requires technical skills, and equipment that is not likely to be found in a kitchen store.



     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 26, 2013
  15. kb3lms

    kb3lms Subscriber

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    Actually, I have 3 bottles of McCormick Red food coloring that list the ingredients as Red 40 and Red 3. They are a couple years old now and the current McCormick formula may have changed. Regardless, if you want to use food dye for emulsion purposes, I agree that the Neon coloring would be a better choice.

    As an aside, the Red #3 food dye I got from the nice lady on eBay appears in all respects to be exactly the same as the Erythrosine B I ordered from Magancol in the UK. Have not done any emulsion test yet, which would be the real confirmation. However, my first ortho emulsion is sitting halfway done in the fridge now waiting to be noodle washed. (In other words, at this point I have not yet had a chance to try out ANY ortho emulsion just yet.)

    I'm glad to see the Formulary is making the Erythrosine available. That really helps to take some of the angst out of the process for those interested in trying.

    -- Jason
     
  16. Mustafa Umut Sarac

    Mustafa Umut Sarac Member

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    Erythrosine Rose Bengal costs 1 dollar 1 gram or 320 dollar 1000 grams at China.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 7, 2013
  17. Photo Engineer

    Photo Engineer Subscriber

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    Remember that this is not an outstanding green sensitizer. Baker suggests adding it at the start of the precipitation. It is adequate, but not outstanding. It is certainly inexpensive.

    PE
     
  18. Mustafa Umut Sarac

    Mustafa Umut Sarac Member

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    PE,

    I sent 6 or 7 buying threads to www.alibaba.com dye section. 30 replies for all autochrome dyes , most expensive one 10 dollars per gram to cheapest one 25 cents for 1 gram. They are ready to ship ship loads of dyes , few others even wanted me to be their distribütör.

    Amazing environment for business. I bought amazing copies of Ross Simon chronometer for few dollars including a Rado , Movado and Swatch replicas. Swatch replicas costs me 3 dollars each , original 60 dollars or faraway more. All postage is free !!!! also and registered.
    Some watches came and we amazed by quality.
     
  19. Athiril

    Athiril Subscriber

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